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Decide if these 2 positions are drawn

Decide if these 2 positions are drawn

Only Chess

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I keep ending up in some complex endgames, so I will present another game I just played today. Feel free to comment on the game itself.

It was TD2007 (1707) vs Ramned (1746)

Time: 60 / 60

Game result: 0-1

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  • 8
  • a
  • 7
  • b
  • 6
  • c
  • 5
  • d
  • 4
  • e
  • 3
  • f
  • 2
  • g
  • 1
  • h
1.e4d6
2.Nc3g6
3.f4Bg7
4.Nf3Bg4
5.Be2Nc6
6.O-OQd7
7.Bb5a6
8.Ba4O-O-O
9.Qe1Bxf3
10.Rxf3Nh6
11.d3f5
12.Be3Rhf8
13.Bxc6Qxc6
14.Nd5Rde8
15.c3a5
16.c4fxe4
17.dxe4e6
18.Nc3Qxc4
19.Rc1Bxc3
20.Rxc3Qxe4
21.Qc1c6
22.Bb6Rf5
23.Rfe3Qxf4
24.Rxc6Kb8
25.Rc2Ref8
26.h3Qf1
27.Qxf1Rxf1
28.Kh2Rc8
29.Rxc8Kxc8
30.Rxe6Kd7
31.Re2Rf5
32.Rc2Ke6
33.Rc8Rb5
34.Bd4Nf5
35.Bc3Rc5
36.Rb8Rb5
37.g4Ne7
38.Rf8h5
39.Rf6Kd7
40.a4Rc5
41.gxh5gxh5
42.Rf7Ke6
43.Rf6Kd7
44.Rf7Ke6
45.Rf6Kd7
46.Rf7Rf5
47.Rxf5Nxf5
48.Bxa5d5
49.Bd2Nd6
50.Kg3Ne4
51.Kh4Nxd2
52.Kxh5Ke6
53.Kg4Ke5
54.h4Ne4
55.Kf3Kd4
56.h5Kc5
57.Ke3Nf6
58.b3Nxh5

0


      Note that I was getting in some time trouble around move 23 (I had 7 minutes of clock left and it was still unclear to me).

      Up to move 23, I believe I played a pretty strong game (move 10 perhaps should have played h4 before Nh3 intending a safe f5 push). I especially value comments regarding moves 1-23.

      5 edits
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      WHITE TO MOVE. (Move 24)


      • 8
      • a
      • 7
      • b
      • 6
      • c
      • 5
      • d
      • 4
      • e
      • 3
      • f
      • 2
      • g
      • 1
      • h




      -What could black have done better on move 22 and on move 23?

      1 edit
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      We reached this position after several errors on my fault (and 1 major error on his).

      BLACK TO MOVE

      • 8
      • a
      • 7
      • b
      • 6
      • c
      • 5
      • d
      • 4
      • e
      • 3
      • f
      • 2
      • g
      • 1
      • h




      I really need to work on keeping my head in the game for the ENTIRE game, not just half. Of course time pressure was a factor.

      2 edits
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      Originally posted by Ramned
      WHITE TO MOVE.


      [fen]4r3/1p1k3p/1Bppp1pn/p4r2/5q2/2R1R3/PP4PP/2Q3K1[/fen]



      -What could black have done better on move 22 and on move 23?
      Position #1. Black is clearly winning due to his surplus of pawns and the threat of Qf2+ must be dealt with probably by Qe1 since moving the e3 rook allows QxQ simplifying and making the extra pawns more apparent. More thought is required. I havn't yet played through the game so I can't comment on better moves for black. Another candidate move for white is h3

      Edit 1: You asked about 22 & 23 but I prefer 21... Rf2. It's just a more useful move allowing rook doubling while still protecting your king.

      move 22: I can't find anything better than Rf5 though it feels funny. Your a-pawn is threatened, but I don't really care. The knight is the piece that bugs me the most, as it looks like your rook is taking the knights natural location.

      move 23: staring at this I see Rxc6+. I'm not sure what else to play though. Qb4, Rb3, Qxf4 is what I want to play but clearly that doesn't deal with Qb4, Rxc6+

      Edit3: Move 22 I prefer Re7 since it affords some defense to the rook sac.

      2 edits
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      Originally posted by Ramned
      We reached this position after several errors on my fault (and 1 major error on his).

      BLACK TO MOVE

      [fen]8/1p5p/3pk1p1/pr3n2/5R2/2B4P/PP4P1/6K1 b[/fen]



      I really need to work on keeping my head in the game for the ENTIRE game, not just half. Of course time pressure was a factor.
      Position #2. INteresting position.

      Black is a passed pawn to the good but has a slightly worse minor piece (short range knight vrs whites bishop) and his rook is seriously out of play. His king is more involved in the endgame.

      White has the better minor piece and rook, but his king needs to become useful. g4 kicking the knight and allowing Rf6+ looks appealing but may well be one of those moves my eye is drawn to but doesn't really accomplish anything useful.

      I think black has a winning advantage but it is hard to realize. I'm going to go back through the whole game, then review position 1 before returning to this.


      Edit 1: I can't seem to find this in your game... the white rook is in the wrong spot, I think it should be on b8? ala move 36.

      Sadly the move I like best is Nh6 allowing for Rf4 and if an immediate Rf6+ then Ke7 holding the pawn and denying the rook the seventh rank while preparing to redeploy the knight once the rook comes over. I expect

      Nh6, Rf6+, Ke7, g4, Rd4/Nf7 (I"m not sure which is best).

      1 edit
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      Why didn't White claim (or did the application not declare) the draw by threefold repetition?

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      Originally posted by heinzkat
      Why didn't White claim (or did the application not declare) the draw by threefold repetition?
      That never occured. He advanced his pawn before we repeated the rook and king position.

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      It looks to me like the position after white's moves 42, 44, and 46 is identical.

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      Originally posted by incandenza
      It looks to me like the position after white's moves 42, 44, and 46 is identical.
      45. ... Kd7 =

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