Originally posted by MISTER CHESSWhatever you think of the Evergreen game in general, for a player looking to make the Evans' Gambit a part of his repertoire, it is essential.
I never really liked that game either. It is not that amazing in reality... black blundered and white won. ...Bc5 is what black should have played threatening to safely play the move he played. 😛
The Immortal game is essential to the King's Gambit player.
Hi Wulebgr
And there we differ mate.
From a teaching point of view.
There are some clearer easier to understand games played after 1852
when the Evans was fashioned into a fine art form to show the student.
Some of them are perfect examples for demonstrating what a true pawn gambit
is all about. Games they can understand and do not scare them witless by showing
them the Evergreen....
"Am I expected to do that?" You have lost them. You might as well ask
them to play like Tal.
As for the Kings' Gambit. I never recommend that to any under 1600
player wanting to improve. 2.Nf3 is a better move than 2.f4.
Get them to play by 'feel' not having to memorise variations to stay on the board.
If they ask about the King's Gambit I just tell them they are not ready
for that yet. You have to be a good player to play it.
White has no need to take a risk like 2.f4
Of course once I have them up from a beginner to a good/strong club player,
which is about as far as I take them. They can go and do what the hell they like.
Originally posted by Guych1st game:
Hello, I'd like to have Evan's gabmit in my arsenal for whites. However, I seem to do bad with it. Is it not a good gambit? I think it's an OK gambit against club players (around 1100-1300 of FICS blitz).
Here is an example. Here I blundered big time, so it is not a good example. Anyway, I seem not to know how to use my development advantage. Please help! L e4 17. Qxe4 d6 18. Bd3 f5 19. Qf4 Bf6 20. Rxe8+ Qxe8 21. Qh6 Bxa1 0-1 [/pgn]
6.0-0 is too passive. You cant give away pawns (in a gambit) and then sit back and play passively. Look at forcing moves that compel black to respond. The normal move here is 6.d4 but it leads to a more positional type of game. I play 6.Qb3 (threatening 7.Bxf7+) which leads to a more Evans Gambit type of game and is perfectly playable. It also makes sense because the bishop blocks the Q from going to e7 to defend f7.
8. cxd5 is kind of pointless. Black can castle on the next move if wants. The whole point is to keep black from castling. Thats one ofthe main ways to use your development advantage and open lines.
Originally posted by Guych2nd game:
Here is another Evans gambit, again I'm playing white, and I lost. This time it is 15 min game 15/0 on FICS (so I had more time to think but still lost).
[pgn][Event "rated standard match"]
[Site "Free Internet Chess Server"]
[Date "2009.04.28"]
[White "GuychRock"]
[Result "0-1"]
[WhiteElo "1478"]
[BlackElo "1557"]
[TimeControl "900"]
1. e4 e5 2. ...[text shortened]... 4 54. g5 fxg5 55. fxg5 Ka3 56. h4 b2 57. Kc2 Ka2 {GuychRock resigns} 0-1 [/pgn]
6.0-0 is a mistake here too. It allows black to play Lasker's defense which is a very good line for black. Correct is 6.d4 followed by 7.0-0 (after 6...exd4).
8. cxd4 is absolutely awful. First, it allows black to castle and wastes a move. Second, it hangs the e4 pawn Third, it prevents you from bringing your rook to e1. etc.
Originally posted by GuychGame 3:
Here is where I finally win in 15/0 FICS game:
[pgn][Event "rated standard match"]
[Site "Free Internet Chess Server"]
[Date "2009.05.17"]
[White "GuychRock"]
[Result "1-0"]
[WhiteElo "1493"]
[BlackElo "1448"]
[TimeControl "900"]
1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 Bc5 4. b4 Nxb4 5. c3 Nc6 6. d4 exd4 7. cxd4 Bb4+ 8. Nbd2 Nf6 9. O-O O-O 10. e5 Bc3 11. Rb1 N ...[text shortened]... 25. Rcxc2 Bxc2 26. Rxc2 h6 27. Nxf8 Rxf8 28. Ne6 {andoferni resigns} 1-0 [/pgn]
Again, 7. cxd4 is a mistake. In general, cxd4 is a mistake in the Evans. I cant think of a single line that I play it in and only know of one line that its common to play it. The main reason is that it prevents your rook from coming to e1 if black has a B on a5 or b4. Its also usually a waste of time. The correct move there is 7. 0-0 because black cant play 7...dxc3 because of 8.Bxf7+ !, Kxf7 9. Qd5+ winning back the B and white has a very good game. I'll also point out that dxc3 is usually bad for black. If black wants to waste time grabbing pawns I'm usually more than happy to let him.
8. Nbd2 doesnt look very good to me. It blocks the B. 8. Bd2 is better because it develops better and creates a threat (Bxb4,Nxb4, Bxf7+,Kxf7, Qb3)
It looks like to me your problems are
1)Playing too passively. You need to play aggressively and play forcing moves. Thats how you build up an initiative to create an attack
2)Not preventing black from castling. If black is getting castled against you in most of your games you might as well be playing some slow boring opening like the 4 knights. A huge part of the reason you give up that material is to trap the king in the center. I always feel like I have to start my attack all over again once black gets castled.
3) Not knowing the basic attacking patterns in the Evans. I recommend playing through some Morphy games paying to attention to the squares that the pieces frequently go to until you begin to notice patterns.
4) Playing too materially. You cant worry about pawns when you're going for checkmate.
Originally posted by Guych
Thank you so much greenpawn! Now I know what a should be studying.
Could you recommend some sources?
http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chess.pl?pid=16002&playercomp=white&opening=C51-C52&title=Paul%20Morphy%20playing%20the%20Evans%20Gambit%20as%20White
Originally posted by greenpawn34Fair enough. I respect your view, but I'll hold to my own. Of course, I don't eschew those other simpler games. They do lay a critical foundation. But, if the student is unprepared for chaos, perhaps he or she should take up checkers. The Evergreen game illustrates both the complexities and the errors that one should learn to expect in practical play.
Hi Wulebgr
And there we differ mate.
There are others that think any game played before Karpov is not worthwhile to the modern player. A good friend that is a stronger player than me is one of these. I respect his views, but I keep looking at old games.
Originally posted by Wulebgrhow can one dismiss the work of Greco, Morphy, Capa, Reti, Tarrasch, Nimso,
Fair enough. I respect your view, but I'll hold to my own. Of course, I don't eschew those other simpler games. They do lay a critical foundation. But, if the student is unprepared for chaos, perhaps he or she should take up checkers. The Evergreen game illustrates both the complexities and the errors that one should learn to expect in practical play.
T ...[text shortened]... stronger player than me is one of these. I respect his views, but I keep looking at old games.
Botvinnik, Bronstein, Petrosian as having no value? I think it is fascinating to trace
the historical development of an idea, see it adopted and refined by other players.
Just by way of example i was fascinated that Capa liked to restrict an opponents
piece on one side of the board and thus use it as an inducement to launch a
successful attack on the other.
Winter v Capablanca , Hastings 1919
A classical example of how to restrict a minor piece.
Again we see the idea adopted by Tarrash, Petrosian and lots of other great players,
why should this have no value, i do not know?
Sowwy for diversion, i shall intrude no more.
Hi Guych,
in the first game, at least, you seem to me to have reached a very good position after move 17. If you had prevented black's ...f5 by playing 18.Nh4 (or Nd4 possibly) then black would have been in trouble.
I agree that white's play after 5...Be7 was not best, but on the positive side black played passively after taking the second pawn (not getting...d5 in, getting pinned on the e-file etc) while you made the most of your position. That kind of persistence is part of being a successful gambit player,
keep going!
Originally posted by dikankanThanks for the encouragement, Dikankan 🙂
Hi Guych,
in the first game, at least, you seem to me to have reached a very good position after move 17. If you had prevented black's ...f5 by playing 18.Nh4 (or Nd4 possibly) then black would have been in trouble.
I agree that white's play after 5...Be7 was not best, but on the positive side black played passively after taking the second pawn (not ge ...[text shortened]... position. That kind of persistence is part of being a successful gambit player,
keep going!
I like Evans gambit, so I'll keep up the persistence.
Thanks everyone for your advices. Greenpawn34, I haven't done the homework of going through the classic games that you provided yet 🙂. But here is an interesting game (I think). Just after finishing this 5 min game I thought I was learning to be a bit more aggressive, but later noticed that I missed QxBc5. The knight move I played instead was bad. Then my opponent missed a threat of mate in one and I won.
So, here is my fun little game (5/0 on FICS):
Any comments welcome.
Originally posted by GuychBetter but...
Thanks everyone for your advices. Greenpawn34, I haven't done the homework of going through the classic games that you provided yet 🙂. But here is an interesting game (I think). Just after finishing this 5 min game I thought I was learning to be a bit more aggressive, but later noticed that I missed QxBc5. The knight move I played instead was bad. Then my opp ...[text shortened]... + Kg8 15. Qg6 Be6 16. Qxg7# {tepez checkmated} 1-0[/pgn]
Any comments welcome.
After 7...dxc3 I would play 8. Bxf7+!. It stops him from castling permanently and if he takes the bishop you can win it back with 9. Qd5+.
After 8...Nge7,I woud play Ng5. 9...0-0 would be very bad for black because of 10. Qh5 ! attacking the h7 pawn twice (and threatening mate) and the f7 pawn 3 times. There's no way black can defend both. Look for that anytime the N comes to e7. Black can defend better with d5 or Ne5 but you can still build up a strong attack.
I also like 10 exd5 better than the Q because it gains time on the N and opens the e-file.
Although your play after that isnt objectively as good as it could be, it shows you're getting the right idea. Ignoring material and continuing to develop and create threats : very strong. You've improved quite a bit. Keep doing what you're doing.
Originally posted by savage4731Thank you very much savage4731,
Better but...
After 7...dxc3 I would play 8. Bxf7+!. It stops him from castling permanently and if he takes the bishop you can win it back with 9. Qd5+.
After 8...Nge7,I woud play Ng5. 9...0-0 would be very bad for black because of 10. Qh5 ! attacking the h7 pawn twice (and threatening mate) and the f7 pawn 3 times. There's no way black can defend ...[text shortened]... and create threats : very strong. You've improved quite a bit. Keep doing what you're doing.
I really liked your tactical points, especially about Bxf7, and Ng5. 🙂 I was genuinely impressed with those move possibilities.
And thank you for encouragement.