#### Only Chess Forum

1. 15 Feb '16 13:47
Say you're in a RHP section with three 2400s. Now say you're not competitive even against 2200s. I wondered if you could just copy moves by Player A and play them against Player B? If strategy is sound, how would you maximize against three players?
2.  sonhouse
Fast and Curious
15 Feb '16 14:21 / 1 edit
Originally posted by tonytiger41
Say you're in a RHP section with three 2400s. Now say you're not competitive even against 2200s. I wondered if you could just copy moves by Player A and play them against Player B? If strategy is sound, how would you maximize against three players?
That's a variation on the simul scam, where you have alternate white and black so you end up say playing two 2600 players and you are 2200, but you arrange your moves so the 2600's are playing each other. You copy the moves from one to the other.
That can only work if you have black in one game and white in another.
3.  Gambrel
BoomShaLakLakBoom
16 Feb '16 03:36
Move mirroring is a form of cheating. Bannable at many sites.
4. 16 Feb '16 13:54
Even if it is not cheating, which it seems to be, what is the point? And where is the joy? Chess should be about more than just winning an individual game or ratings.
5.  Paul Leggett
Chess Librarian
16 Feb '16 14:20
Originally posted by tonytiger41
Say you're in a RHP section with three 2400s. Now say you're not competitive even against 2200s. I wondered if you could just copy moves by Player A and play them against Player B? If strategy is sound, how would you maximize against three players?
The answer to the question "Why do I play the game of chess?' may shed light on your conundrum.

Paul
6.  Ponderable
chemist
16 Feb '16 14:27
Originally posted by tonytiger41
Say you're in a RHP section with three 2400s. Now say you're not competitive even against 2200s. I wondered if you could just copy moves by Player A and play them against Player B? If strategy is sound, how would you maximize against three players?
This one is quite old. Without being a Master player myself:

If you are i a three person group and manage to pull off the stunt in a double round Robin the best you get is to win two and lose two. Maybe you can even advance. BHut if you have bad Timing you could face the Problem to either lose on time or to Chose a move for yourself. Since you are not up to the Standard it will be more probably a losing than a winning move.

Some time back a Video was hsown here were a guy did manage to win more than he lost in a simul of his by applying the trick. But he had to win against the weakest Player all by himself ðŸ™‚
7.  moonbus
Uber-Nerd
16 Feb '16 14:58
I read somewhere that some postal chess player tried the same scam w/ Lasker and Capablanca, playing Capa's moves in his game against Lasker and v.v.

Lasker and Capa got wise to it and stopped playing the man.
8.  moonbus
Uber-Nerd
16 Feb '16 18:45
PS, you would not being playing an opponent yourself, you would in effect be duping two other players into becoming opponents by proxy, without their knowledge and consent. Not kosher.
9.  DeepThought
17 Feb '16 10:09
Originally posted by tonytiger41
Say you're in a RHP section with three 2400s. Now say you're not competitive even against 2200s. I wondered if you could just copy moves by Player A and play them against Player B? If strategy is sound, how would you maximize against three players?
This was mentioned in a thread years ago and it's defeatable. The poster didn't give the method but I'd imagine a procedure as follows. The two players whose moves are being copied have to realise and pm each other. One stops playing and the other makes a move. The one that stopped waits until a day has been shaved off his timebank and then moves in his game, the other player does the same. The two genuine players take notes on how long it takes the cheat to move and what times of day are best to move to run down his clock. A four hour delay from moving when he's asleep per move will mean that he will tend to run out of time faster. Because the cheat has to wait for the other players to move before he knows what to do he'll eventually be forced to either lose on time or make a move on his own.
10. 17 Feb '16 17:24 / 1 edit
Originally posted by tonytiger41
Say you're in a RHP section with three 2400s. Now say you're not competitive even against 2200s. I wondered if you could just copy moves by Player A and play them against Player B? If strategy is sound, how would you maximize against three players?
That scam has been used as a plot device in a couple of short stories.
Old ones going way back .
11. 21 Feb '16 13:07
Originally posted by Paul Leggett
The answer to the question "Why do I play the game of chess?' may shed light on your conundrum.

Paul
lets say, hypothetically, that you suspect the 2400s to be machine enhanced players?
12. 21 Feb '16 16:05
If so inclined you could do it across websites that way it would be very
hard to spot. You could run The top RHP player v the top lad from GameKnot.

The trouble is if both players are cheats then all these 99% match up
moves are suddenly attached to you and you get banned from both sites ðŸ™‚
13.  Ragwort
Ex Duris Gloria
21 Feb '16 16:20
If you think playing against machines or machine assisted players is a waste of time don't waste any time playing them.

If you think that, as Tim Krabbe once wrote, you are getting 2400+ play from a 2400+ "identity" then does it actually matter what they are?
14.  Paul Leggett
Chess Librarian
21 Feb '16 18:12 / 1 edit
Originally posted by Ragwort
If you think playing against machines or machine assisted players is a waste of time don't waste any time playing them.

If you think that, as Tim Krabbe once wrote, you are getting 2400+ play from a 2400+ "identity" then does it actually matter what they are?
This was going to be my response, but Ragwort beat me to it. It begs the question "Why do you play?"

Concocting a scam because you suspect another of cheating is poor justification to do so yourself.

I don't think that is your intent- I believe you were trying to have fun with this- but when we start trying to rationalize such actions, the slope becomes very slippery.

It also creates a pitiful alibi for anyone who does cheat and gets caught (Hey, I suspected they were cheating, and I was.. just trying to level the playing field, you know? I wasn't actually trying to cheat myself...).