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  1. Standard member HomerJSimpson
    Renouned Grob Killer
    14 Mar '07 03:57 / 2 edits
    Something about that opening pisses me off. Im not sure I can pin point what exactly I dont like about it.

    What I do know is that I do hate the fact that I give up my strong central d pawn for my opponents c pawn. I also dont like the fact that my opponent knows more about the opening then I do. I also dont like the fact that it scores a higher winning percentage then white. I think the thing I hate most about it, is the person playing me is making it out like they want to play a flank opening, when infact they hate positional games, and they want me to advance that d pawn. Ive been thinking about it, and I want to torture that nasty c5 player the best way I can, and that is to NOT play d4. Instead give them the dread SYMNETRICAL ENGLISH!

    Ive found that by playing c4 after 1.e4 c5 2. nf3 d6 3. Bb5+ just seems to take the spirit of that poor sicilian player. Generally they dont like the closed, positional motifs that arise from that system. I also think that they would have played something different if I started out with c4 right off the bat, perhaps a backwards sicilian?

    I like this strategy because it presents a completly different style of game then what my oppoent is accustom to. I also like the fact that I generally know more about this system then my oppoent does (as oppose to vice versa the other way). And Im also not compremising the pawn structure of my position.

    What are your thoughts people, how do you like to attack the sicilian?

    rant ovah!
  2. 14 Mar '07 04:09
    Originally posted by HomerJSimpson
    ...What are your thoughts people, how do you like to attack the sicilian?

    rant ovah!
    2.d4
  3. 14 Mar '07 04:12
    Well, there's a lot of different systems you can play against the sicilian if you don't like the open game. have you tried 2.Nc3?
  4. 14 Mar '07 04:18
    the sicilian has a lot of theory for both sides and there are certain things that are hard to understand. i dont see people below 1600 playing the sicilian at a level that they can win as white when the wrong tactics are employed after trading off the d pawn. the closed sicilian works and i hate facing it when i'm in the sicilian but i've learned to adapt. i'm starting to play c4 so i dont encounter the french i hate that more than u hate the sicilian.
  5. Standard member Diet Coke
    Forum Vampire
    14 Mar '07 04:18
    Accept it, e4 is dross and there are at least two moves which prove this...c5 and e6.

    Play something sensible like c4.
  6. 14 Mar '07 05:21
    Originally posted by HomerJSimpson
    Something about that opening pisses me off. Im not sure I can pin point what exactly I dont like about it.

    What I do know is that I do hate the fact that I give up my strong central d pawn for my opponents c pawn. I also dont like the fact that my opponent knows more about the opening then I do. I also dont like the fact that it scores a higher ...[text shortened]... osition.

    What are your thoughts people, how do you like to attack the sicilian?

    rant ovah!
    The Sicilian certainly scores better for White than Black. In fact, I don't even think it is all it's cracked up to be on an objective basis. It's just that Black tends to be far more knowledgeable, and the positions are so complex that even if White has an advantage, keeping it requires navigating a great maze of complex moves.
  7. Standard member Dies Irae
    I Love U
    14 Mar '07 07:09
    I've been playing the sicilian as black my whole time here and I do pretty good with it and I know nothing of the theory all I know is that i like it
  8. Standard member buffalobill
    Major Bone
    14 Mar '07 09:01
    Originally posted by Diet Coke
    Accept it, e4 is dross and there are at least two moves which prove this...c5 and e6.

    Play something sensible like c4.
    Explain why 1. e4 is the preferred opening of the +1900 players on this site and the one that has the best win ratio for White. And that the best winning chances for Black are 1. ...e5
  9. 14 Mar '07 09:02 / 1 edit
    I think the reason the Sicilian is so good is perhaps because it is the most logical AND active defense against e4. It's also one of the reasons why I chose to play it against 1. e4 and why I favour 1. d4 myself (there are of course also other reasons why I play 1. d4 mostly).
  10. 14 Mar '07 10:28
    Originally posted by buffalobill
    Explain why 1. e4 is the preferred opening of the +1900 players on this site
    Computers tend to prefer the tactical games that 1.e4 can give
  11. 14 Mar '07 11:23 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by HomerJSimpson
    Something about that opening pisses me off. Im not sure I can pin point what exactly I dont like about it.

    What I do know is that I do hate the fact that I give up my strong central d pawn for my opponents c pawn. I also dont like the fact that my opponent knows more about the opening then I do. I also dont like the fact that it scores a higher ...[text shortened]... osition.

    What are your thoughts people, how do you like to attack the sicilian?

    rant ovah!
    The thing about the sicilian, is that it's good for white and ambitious for black.

    You're talking about your frustration at encoutering sicilian players who know the theory of the open sicilian better than you do. The single unfortunate answer is that the open sicilian is the strongest reply and you must learn it to some extent.

    You can try closed variations but in most cases this is simply granting immediate equality to black. If you try g6 , c4 or f4 early then you need to understand closed d4 or c4 style games.

    I'm an 1800 player and after trying everything over many years, the sicilian became my main e4 defence.

    Against anything but the open sicilian, I am in happyland; I get an calm game with black where i can play for a draw very easily if I start to lose.

    Against open sicilian variations such as The english attack, the Richter Rauzer, The Bc4 sicilian , I am very scared as black. black usually delays castling and as a result white has a wealth of dangerous sacrifices at his disposal. It is a delicate dancing defence that is very difficult. So as an e4 practitioner If you want to succed beyond 1600 level, you need to learn the many open variations. You will start seeing well known piece sacs after 10 moves.

    The sicilian must be studied at least a few moves into the middle game. You will need to understand all the white sacs that threaten (mostly based around the e6 square) here. Only then may proficiency of known continuations be achieved.

    I know this sucks but such is chess. If you want to specialize in e4 AND go beyond 1600, then this theory is necessary.

    The white side of the sicilian is VERY dangerous.

    As a sicilian fan and practitioner, I can still say that IMHO white is better and when I encounter strong white play, I am hoping and playing for a draw.
  12. 14 Mar '07 12:04
    There area couple of other responses to c5 that will lead to interesting play:

    2. d4 followed by 3.c3 (Morra Gambit)
    2. Nc3 (closed Sicilian)
    2. f4 followed by 3.Nf3 (Grand Prix Attack)
    3. b4 (somewhat dubious Wing Gambit)

    Personally, I hate playing against the Sicilian. I always feel like I don't have any way to get a solid attack going. The Najdorf is particularly frustrating because Black's pawn on a6 and eventual b5, Bb7 moves cause many problems for White. Does anyone have a good strategy for playing against this variation?
  13. 14 Mar '07 12:20
    Originally posted by 93confirmed
    There area couple of other responses to c5 that will lead to interesting play:

    2. d4 followed by 3.c3 (Morra Gambit)
    2. Nc3 (closed Sicilian)
    2. f4 followed by 3.Nf3 (Grand Prix Attack)
    3. b4 (somewhat dubious Wing Gambit)

    Personally, I hate playing against the Sicilian. I always feel like I don't have any way to get a solid attack going. The ...[text shortened]... many problems for White. Does anyone have a good strategy for playing against this variation?
    3.c3 d3 now black has a comfortable position.
    2.f4?! d5! this move killed the f4 sicilian at nearly every level.

    There are at least three strong systems against the najdorf. bg5 or be3 or Bc4 are all very strong plans that simply take quite deep study to properly understand.
  14. 14 Mar '07 12:33 / 1 edit
    To defeat the Najdorf you must be 1.aggressive 2.brave 3. knowledgable. If you do not confront this opening with angry disapproval at blacks cheek, then you will not gain an advantage.

    ....a6 is a waiting move mostly, that says -"come on white, lets see what your gunna bring, I'll deal with it."
  15. 14 Mar '07 12:40
    Originally posted by HomerJSimpson
    Something about that opening pisses me off. Im not sure I can pin point what exactly I dont like about it.

    What I do know is that I do hate the fact that I give up my strong central d pawn for my opponents c pawn. I also dont like the fact that my opponent knows more about the opening then I do. I also dont like the fact that it scores a higher ...[text shortened]... osition.

    What are your thoughts people, how do you like to attack the sicilian?

    rant ovah!
    1.e4 c5 2.c4 and the symmetrical English appears...I've seen it before, it really bothers me.