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  1. Standard member Bosse de Nage
    Zellulärer Automat
    31 Oct '05 16:27
    What are they?
  2. Standard member ark13
    Enola Straight
    31 Oct '05 16:29
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    What are they?
    Pawns whose capture would result in some problems for the capturer, ranging from minor inconviences to the loss of the game.
  3. 31 Oct '05 17:27 / 4 edits
    There are well-known poisened pawn variations in the opening phase (Sicilian, Najdorf, PP-variation for instance). But also in the middle- and endgame this occurs. Fameous example is the second game in the Spassky-Fischer match (Rejkjavik 1972) for the WC title. Black (Fischer), on move 29, takes the pawn on h2 and will regret that later (although Fischer maintained that he had 'seen' this before making the move).



    Entire game:
    1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 e6 3.Nf3 d5 4.Nc3 Bb4 5.e3 0–0 6.Bd3 c5 7.0–0 Nc6 8.a3 Ba5 9.Ne2 dxc4 10.Bxc4 Bb6 11.dxc5 Qxd1 12.Rxd1 Bxc5 13.b4 Be7 14.Bb2 Bd7 15.Rac1 Rfd8 16.Ned4 Nxd4 17.Nxd4 Ba4 18.Bb3 Bxb3 19.Nxb3 Rxd1+ 20.Rxd1 Rc8 21.Kf1 Kf8 22.Ke2 Ne4 23.Rc1 Rxc1 24.Bxc1 f6 25.Na5 Nd6 26.Kd3 Bd8 27.Nc4 Bc7 28.Nxd6 Bxd6 29.b5 Bxh2 30.g3 h5 31.Ke2 h4 32.Kf3 Ke7 33.Kg2 hxg3 34.fxg3 Bxg3 35.Kxg3 Kd6 36.a4 Kd5 37.Ba3 Ke4 38.Bc5 a6 39.b6 f5 40.Kh4 f4 41.exf4 Kxf4 42.Kh5 Kf5 43.Be3 Ke4 44.Bf2 Kf5 45.Bh4 e5 46.Bg5 e4 47.Be3 Kf6 48.Kg4 Ke5 49.Kg5 Kd5 50.Kf5 a5 51.Bf2 g5 52.Kxg5 Kc4 53.Kf5 Kb4 54.Kxe4 Kxa4 55.Kd5 Kb5 56.Kd6 1-0.

    edits: messed with FEN
  4. Standard member Bowmann
    Non-Subscriber
    31 Oct '05 18:01


    Can Black safely play QxP?

    No. After 1...Qxb2, White wins the black Queen by 2. Na4.
  5. Standard member ShallowBlue
    Bah Humbug!
    31 Oct '05 20:31
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    What are they?
    I think this is a good example. Game 578434
    After 15...Qxb2, winning a supposedly 'free' pawn, white proceeds with a kingside attack. The cost of the pawn is that blacks queen is out of the way and cannot quickly aid the defence. In fact she is so poorly positioned after taking the 'poisoned pawn' she takes to further part in the game and black is quickly defeated!
  6. Standard member Natural Science
    blunderer of pawns
    01 Nov '05 10:19 / 2 edits
    Originally posted by ShallowBlue
    I think this is a good example. Game 578434
    After 15...Qxb2, winning a supposedly 'free' pawn, white proceeds with a kingside attack. The cost of the pawn is that blacks queen is out of the way and cannot quickly aid the defence. In fact she is so poorly positioned after taking the 'poisoned pawn' she takes to further part in the game and black is quickly defeated!
    Nice. A poisoned pawn, and a poisoned knight in the same game.

    (and yes, I did see that he had to take the knight.)
  7. Standard member ShallowBlue
    Bah Humbug!
    01 Nov '05 15:17
    Originally posted by Natural Science
    Nice. A poisoned pawn, and a poisoned knight in the same game.

    (and yes, I did see that he had to take the knight.)
    Thanks
  8. Standard member Trains44
    Full speed locomotiv
    01 Nov '05 16:00
    Originally posted by Bowmann
    [fen]rnb1kb1r/1p3ppp/pq1ppn2/6B1/3NPP2/P1N5/1PP3PP/R2QKB1R[/fen]

    Can Black safely play QxP?

    No. After 1...Qxb2, White wins the black Queen by 2. Na4.
    Silly...NO, Even I can see that.
  9. 01 Nov '05 17:18
    Originally posted by TRAINS44
    Silly...NO, Even I can see that.
    I can't.
  10. Standard member Bosse de Nage
    Zellulärer Automat
    02 Nov '05 13:35
    Thanks for your comments...

    Are there any, how you say, openings or tactics that attempt to set up poisoned pieces?
  11. 29 Nov '05 19:57
    Don't forget the Poisoned Pawn variation of the French Winawer - great dynamic play from Black's point of view (as I am a French Defence lover).
  12. 29 Nov '05 21:02
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    Thanks for your comments...

    Are there any, how you say, openings or tactics that attempt to set up poisoned pieces?
    There is the poison pawn variation of the najdorf (and winawer as was mentioned, but I play the classical french lines so I know nothing about it).

    My little pamphlet here is yellow and so old as to not be in algebraic notation (the cover is lost so I dont have a copyright, but if memory serves its roughly '67). Anyway, it gives
    1. e4 c5
    2. Nf3 d6
    3. d4 cxd4
    4. Nxd4 Nf6
    5. Nc3 a6
    6. Bg5 e6
    7. f4 Qb6

    with the pawn on b2 being 'poisoned'

    Actually if memory serves me right black can get away with taking one pawn at the expense of a kingside attack/uncomfortable game. Taking more than one is supposed to be sure defeat. That however, is among GM's with nearly flawless play.
  13. Standard member XanthosNZ
    Cancerous Bus Crash
    29 Nov '05 21:52
    Originally posted by zebano
    There is the poison pawn variation of the najdorf (and winawer as was mentioned, but I play the classical french lines so I know nothing about it).

    My little pamphlet here is yellow and so old as to not be in algebraic notation (the cover is lost so I dont have a copyright, but if memory serves its roughly '67). Anyway, it gives
    1. e4 c5
    2. Nf3 d6 ...[text shortened]... than one is supposed to be sure defeat. That however, is among GM's with nearly flawless play.
    The most common line is 8. Qd2 Qxb2 9. Rb1 Qa3 so yes black can take the pawn. However white has enough compensation for the pawn and the position is still considered even.