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  1. 27 Jan '10 00:00 / 1 edit
    Today I got to game 5,Bisguier-Ivkov,Bled (14) 1961.

    This game ends with an unclear position,given below,when Bisguier wins on time.

    It's the first time I encounter this in a games collection.I don't even think the game is a particular good effort by Bisguier.
    Anyway,it left me with a strange feeling.

    Am I right to find this odd or am I missing the point?

    last move was 40.... Bd8
  2. 27 Jan '10 00:01
    Originally posted by Ajuin
    Today I got to game 5,Bisguier-Ivkov,Bled (14) 1961.

    This game ends with an unclear position,included below,when Bisguier wins on time.

    It's the first time I encounter this in a games collection.I don't even think the game is a particular good effort by Bisguier.
    Anyway,it left me with a strange feeling.

    Am I right to find this odd or am I missing th ...[text shortened]... nt?

    last move was 40.... Bd8
    [fen]2Qb4/4Npk1/3pn2p/4p1p1/1q2P3/4BPPK/7P/8 w - - 0 41[/fen]
    40. ... Bd8 can't have been the last official move
  3. 27 Jan '10 00:16
    Why not?
  4. 27 Jan '10 00:17
    Maybe he didn't "win on time", but rather his opponent decided to resign instead of playing on after the adjournment?
  5. 27 Jan '10 00:23
    It is an odd place to end a game - usually a writer would
    gave some variations to indicate why Black resigned (if he did).

    The Bled 1961 table indicates White won.
    And it is a pretty unremarkable game.

    Is this the book you have - it got a terrible review.

    http://www.jeremysilman.com/book_reviews_js/js_art_bisguier.html
  6. 27 Jan '10 00:42
    I get it now.He didn't resign,he played 40.... Bd8 and Bisguier pointed out his flag fell.

    It's volume 2 which got good reviews:
    http://www.jeremysilman.com/book_reviews_jd/Art_of_Bisguier_2.html

    It doesn't just stop with that move,Bisguier does explain.From the book:

    "40... Bd8 Again Borislav found an excellent reply.But as I indicated to him,his flag fell before he could punch the clock.Black is a pawn ahead in the final position.However,his position remains fraught with peril.I'm looking at 41.Nf5+ Kg6 42.Qd7 with such threats as 43.Nxd6 and 43.Qe8.And if 42.... Qc2 (threatening 43.... Qf1+ 44.Kg4 h5) 43.Qxf+ Kxf7 44.Nxd6+ when White will have an extra pawn."

    I still find it odd.
  7. 27 Jan '10 00:53
    That's better.

    You said the game just ended.

    I saw the White threats but nothing conclusive.

    I skipped through it on some site after googling Bled 1961.
    Saw nothing juicy in it all, but perhaps it's one of these where the
    real fun takes place in the notes.

    You have to dig into these games to find the tricks, they don't leap out at you.

    Or was a critical game to clinch his GM title or qualify or something like that.
    Does he say anything in the intro to the game?
  8. 27 Jan '10 01:07
    Originally posted by greenpawn34
    That's better.

    You said the game just ended.

    I saw the White threats but nothing conclusive.

    I skipped through it on some site after googling Bled 1961.
    Saw nothing juicy in it all, but perhaps it's one of these where the
    real fun takes place in the notes.

    You have to dig into these games to find the tricks, they don't leap out at you. ...[text shortened]... s GM title or qualify or something like that.
    Does he say anything in the intro to the game?
    The game ended,the writing continued Ok ok,I gave the wrong impression.Sorry

    Well,if I understand correctly that game took a brilliancy prize

    I'll post the game's intro to see if I'm not misreading things.Will take a while though.
  9. 27 Jan '10 01:20
    A Brilliancy Prize! Maybe best game of the round.

    http://www.rookhouse.com/events/bled1961.html

    All the games get listed at the bottom - look for round 14.
    You cannot lift it and paste here in here as a PGN (well I can't).

    Just played it over again. Nothing. It's a game of chess.
    Bisguier avoids an Ivkov trap.

    (maybe I have spent too long on RHP looking at these games and I've
    forgotten what a proper game of chess looks like)
  10. 27 Jan '10 01:22
    Enter chess geek heinzkat

  11. 27 Jan '10 01:28
    Originally posted by greenpawn34
    A Brilliancy Prize! Maybe best game of the round.

    http://www.rookhouse.com/events/bled1961.html

    All the games get listed at the bottom - look for round 14.
    You cannot lift it and paste here in here as a PGN (well I can't).

    Just played it over again. Nothing. It's a game of chess.
    Bisguier avoids an Ivkov trap.

    (maybe I have spent too long on RHP looking at these games and I've
    forgotten what a proper game of chess looks like)
    Yes,that's the game I'm talking about.Here's the intro:

    Spassky's Second Runs Short of Seconds,Finishes Second to Fischer's Second

    Borislav Ivkov,my round 14 opponent,had won the world junior championship ten years earlier.When we met in 1961,he was ranked 25th in the world.Four years later he ranked in the top 15.By a curious turn of events I was Bobby Fischer's second when he made his 1962 bid for the World Championship.And Borislav was Spassky's second 3 decades later when Bobby won a second match from Boris in Yugoslavia.Of course,neither Fischer nor Spassky made it all the way to a title match in '62.And few regarded their '92 match as having world championship significance - despite the fact that they billed it as such.

    (a picture of a young Bisguier)Arthur Bisguier;the junior for the U.S. team won second brilliancy prize for his 1st round game vs Ivkov and so rated as sole U.S. hero for the first day's play.He also scored a plus 1.5-0.5

    My encounter with Ivkov gave proof to that paradoxical adage that the threat is stronger than the execution.The fact is Borislav found a good answer to everything I threw at him.But while he was searching for good responses,he ran out of time.I'd defeated Ivkov earlier in a radio match between the U.S. and Yugoslavia(see game 15 in AB1).It took a brilliancy prize effort to repaet that feat in Bled.And another adage proved true - that it takes excellent play by the loser to produce a truely brilliant game.
  12. 27 Jan '10 01:42
    "...it takes excellent play by the loser to produce a truely brilliant game."

    Agree with that.

    "The fact is Borislav found a good answer to everything I threw at him."

    He did not throw anything at him.
    He was better and had shots when the flag fell.

    Tear it out of the book and move onto game No.6.
  13. 27 Jan '10 02:16
    Originally posted by greenpawn34
    "...it takes excellent play by the loser to produce a truely brilliant game."

    Agree with that.

    "The fact is Borislav found a good answer to everything I threw at him."

    He did not throw anything at him.
    He was better and had shots when the flag fell.

    Tear it out of the book and move onto game No.6.
    I'll just leave it in and move on to game 6 if you don't mind
  14. 28 Jan '10 02:54
    So I moved on to game 6,Geller-Bisguier,Bled (17),1961



    From this position play went 24.... Bf6 25.Rxf5 Re7 26.Rfe5 Bisguier comments: "A quick admission from Efim that he's having trouble digesting my pawn sacrifice.After ... g6,this rook would have nothing better than an exchange sacrifice anyway."
    But after 26.Rd1 or 26.Ra1-b1-c1 there really isn't any 26.... g6,is there?

    A plausible line could be 26.Rd1 g6? 27.Nxg6 Nxg6 28.Rxf6 Nxf6 29.Qxg6+ 1-0

    Maybe black can try 26.Rd1 Bc8 or just 26.Rd1 Rae8 sacrificing the pawn for control of the e-file.
    White's f-rook is in a tough spot and I doubt grabbing the f-pawn was such a good idea.But not because of g6.

    I'm starting to dislike this book
  15. 28 Jan '10 13:04
    The good thing is you are thinking for yourself and not just taking
    it for granted. Forming your own opinions and questioning.

    This game looks more exciting than the 'brilliancy game'.

    Perhaps king geek HeinzKat will re-enter and post it.