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  1. 31 Oct '06 01:26
    what is more suitable 1 e4 e5 or 1 e4 c5!!!The reasons why do you think it's best
  2. 31 Oct '06 01:36
    Originally posted by kingkong75
    what is more suitable 1 e4 e5 or 1 e4 c5!!!The reasons why do you think it's best
    1. e4 c5 is a labyrinth with many possible replies to study and a portion of your lifetime to master. 1. e4 e5 is over-analyzed, fewer branching points, but each analyzed more deeply. Pick your poison
  3. 31 Oct '06 01:37
    true Ruy Lopez is always with the same kind of play few variations...in the sicilian we got a lot of choice from Najdorf to the Dragon
  4. 31 Oct '06 02:51
    for white or black
  5. 31 Oct '06 03:15
    jonzzzz for white which one is best and for balck which one is best, why?
  6. Standard member Dragon Fire
    Lord of all beasts
    31 Oct '06 09:26
    Originally posted by kingkong75
    true Ruy Lopez is always with the same kind of play few variations...in the sicilian we got a lot of choice from Najdorf to the Dragon
    Absolutely not. The Ruy Lopez has just as many variations and compliactions as the Sicilian from the Exchange to the Open and dozens of variations in between. It need never be the same.

    You choice, as black, on whether to play e5 or c5 is not based on whether you will face the Ruy Lopez or Sicilian but far more than that. If you play e5 are you prepared to play against the Kings Gambit, the Guico Piano, the 2 Knights, 3 Knights, Scotch, Centre Counter, etc. If not don't play e5.

    Against c5 you could face a multitude of replies ranging from d4 to c3 and many quieter options. If you don't want to face these avoid. Consider c6 or e6 instead.
  7. Standard member DeepThought
    Losing the Thread
    31 Oct '06 13:00
    On my database the Sicilian scores 52% and the Ruy Lopez/Spanish 56.3%. So on the basis of pure statistics the Sicilian is better. The problem with that is that which the better opening is depends on you, it's no good playing the Sicilian if your results with it are worse than in the King's pawn game (ie. 1. e4 e5 2. any). You should play the opening that you feel more comfortable with. If you find that you don't know what to do next in Sicilian positions, but do in positions after the Ruy Lopez moves then the Ruy is a better opening for you, and vice versa. Also, Dragon Fire is right - being able to cope with what can happen if white doesn't do what you were hoping for is a significant factor.
  8. 31 Oct '06 14:06
    Originally posted by kingkong75
    what is more suitable 1 e4 e5 or 1 e4 c5!!!The reasons why do you think it's best
    The Closed Spanish is the deepest chess opening strategically. In the middle-game, almost every conceivable piece manouver and pawn break is available to each side, in one form or another. But on the other hand, there's nothing like the Najdorf for seeing a boxer (white) slug it out against a ninja (black.)

    Play them both
  9. 31 Oct '06 17:12
    Originally posted by kingkong75
    what is more suitable 1 e4 e5 or 1 e4 c5!!!The reasons why do you think it's best
    One thing to clear up is that you are asking for opinions about the black pieces. 1e4 e5 is not the Lopez... yet. Dragonfire said it best I think.

    Black does not choose to play the Lopez yet black does choose to play the Sicillian. This is usually why people play the Sicillian, because they are deciding what type of game to play, not white. One thing I have noticed in the Sicillian is that the knights often play a large role in the attack and it is usually harder for whites bishops to be directly involved, instead, one is often fianchettoed. In a Kings Pawn game (1.e4 e5) the bishops have an easier time at becoming directly involved. So, it depends on your style of play. Personally I like 1.e4 e5 because of the intensity of piece conflict. I am actually starting to play 1.d4 in order to learn more strategic themes as to prepare me for playing the Sicillian in the future.

    If you are comfortable with the open style of play where your bishops and knights become developed quickly, play 1.e4 e5. But if you are more comfortable with semi-open games where the pieces don't immediatley come into conflict as much, then play 1.e4 c5.

    If you like knights more then bishops, maybe 1...c5 could suit you better, because you will be avoiding the possiblity of losing a knight in the exchange variation of the Ruy Lopez. If you like bishops more the knights, then its hard to say which one to go with. I'd say 1.e4 e5 has a bit more bishop action right off the bat.

    If anyone would like to correct anything I have said, please feel free to do so.

    Good luck!
  10. 31 Oct '06 20:11
    Caro Kann
  11. 31 Oct '06 20:44
    Originally posted by kingkong75
    what is more suitable 1 e4 e5 or 1 e4 c5!!!The reasons why do you think it's best
    It is a matter of taste.
    None of them is "better" than the other (in known theory).
    1. e4 e5 is an open game, 1. e4 c5 is a semi-open game

    My recommendation is: Play All Openings (PAO).. You need to strengthen yourself in all kinds of positions. Playing new openings also makes chess more fun, since you have some variation, and motivation is important.
  12. 31 Oct '06 21:20
    I agree with the above post. The only way to give yourself a cicumspect knowledge of chess is to play all kinds of positions, and that means trying all openings.

    However, I prefer (as White) some of the variations that can come out of a guioco piano. Game 2513288 is anything but quiet.
  13. Standard member Dragon Fire
    Lord of all beasts
    31 Oct '06 23:12
    Originally posted by gingerbreadman
    I agree with the above post. The only way to give yourself a cicumspect knowledge of chess is to play all kinds of positions, and that means trying all openings.

    However, I prefer (as White) some of the variations that can come out of a guioco piano. Game 2513288 is anything but quiet.
    The Guico Piano is a good first opening to learn as white. Easy to play solidly if you choose and as you get more confident there are a few fiery lines. Migrate from this to the Ruy Lopez when you feel ready. The R L is more complex, more analysed and more dangerous for the unwary but in the hands of a skillfull white deadly against a careless black.
  14. 31 Oct '06 23:22
    As already mentioned you can't really compare the two because one is for white and the other for black. Playing 1. e4 allows black to dictate somewhat the opening, if you really enjoy playing the ruy lopez it's all based on the oppenent playing e5 so when black replies with c5 or another non e5 move then your lopez game goes out the window.

    So for me the Sicilian would the opening to go for because it allows you to push the game into an opening you hopefully know or for that matter most openings with black allow you to direct the play somewhat into postions you know.