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Science Forum

  1. 13 Apr '10 06:34
    http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2010-04/texas-town-turns-monster-battery-backup-power
  2. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    17 Apr '10 03:12 / 4 edits
    Originally posted by zeeblebot
    http://www.popsci.com/technology/article/2010-04/texas-town-turns-monster-battery-backup-power
    so 25 mil for 32 megawatthours of storage, wonder why they put it like they did, 4 mw for 8 hours? Anyway, $780,000 per megawatthour of storage. Wonder how that would stack up to other forms like inertial storage (flywheels in a vacuum) or pumping air into an underground sealed cavern or some such? I guess they put the storage figures like that to show how much energy it could supply at night after PV cells would poop out.
    If you figure an average of 2,000 watts 24/7 as the energy requirement of a typical family, then that battery would provide 1 1/3 megawatts for 24 hours which would be enough for one day for 650 families. For 8 hours, it would be enough for 2600 families. Call it 2500 families and we get a bill of about US$10,000 per family for this service.
    What can we buy for 10,000 bucks that can store 16 Kwhr of energy? How many auto batteries would that take for instance? 16 Kwhr= 2000 watts for 8 hours. A number of something like 1 Kwhr for an average car battery comes to mind, if so, then 16 car batteries would do the trick, of course that would have to be converted to 110 AC 60 Hz or 220 volt AC 50 hz to feed houses which would add quite a bit to the price, probably 4 or 5 thousand bucks for the elctronics alone. 16 batteries at say 100 bucks per, 1600 bucks plus 5K for converters=6600 bucks. Anyone want to verify these numbers?
  3. 17 Apr '10 06:11
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Presidio,_TX

    Population (2000)
    - Total 4,167
    - Density 1,620.1/sq mi (625.5/km2)

    There were 1,285 households out of which 49.3% had children under the age of 18 living with them, 62.6% were married couples living together, 14.4% had a female householder with no husband present, and 19.6% were non-families. 18.8% of all households were made up of individuals and 10.5% had someone living alone who was 65 years of age or older. The average household size was 3.24 and the average family size was 3.73.
  4. 17 Apr '10 06:13
    1300 battery systems sounds complex at the outset.
  5. 17 Apr '10 06:17
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium-sulfur_battery#Electricity_storage_for_grid_support

    These types of batteries present an option for energy storage in locations where other storage options are not feasible due to location or terrain constraints. Pumped-storage hydroelectricity facilities require a lot of space and a significant water resource. Compressed air energy storage (CAES) requires some type of geologic feature for storage.[14]
  6. 17 Apr '10 06:20
    for $25M they've also got the design, site prep, permits and environmental studies, system controls, a very solid-looking (concrete panel?) building, a centralized location, and possibly the upkeep.

    likely grants, too.

    the new utility line is going to be $44M.
  7. 17 Apr '10 06:22
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ojinaga

    Ojinaga (Manuel Ojinaga) is a town and seat of the municipality of Ojinaga, in the northern Mexican state of Chihuahua. As of 2005, the town had a total population of 18,378.[1] It is a rural bordertown on the U.S.-Mexico border, with the city of Presidio, Texas, directly opposite, on the U.S. side of the border. Ojinaga is situated where the Río Conchos drains into the Río Bravo del Norte (Rio Grande). Presidio and Ojinaga are connected by the Presidio-Ojinaga International Bridge.

    ...

    Culture

    Considered one of the most unspoiled Mexican border towns[citation needed], Ojinaga still retains its rural culture and environment, with relatively little pollution and urban problems. Some of the most famous norteño musicians are from Ojinaga, such as Polo Urías, Adolfo Urías, Los Diamantes de Ojinaga, Los Rieleros del Norte, Conjunto Primavera, Los Jilgueros del Arroyo, and Los Norteños de Ojinaga. These artists, unlike many other norteño bands who use solely accordions as the lead instrument, use saxophones and accordions together to create a uniquely Ojinaga-styled norteño music.
  8. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    19 Apr '10 06:20
    Originally posted by zeeblebot
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ojinaga

    Ojinaga (Manuel Ojinaga) is a town and seat of the municipality of Ojinaga, in the northern Mexican state of Chihuahua. As of 2005, the town had a total population of 18,378.[1] It is a rural bordertown on the U.S.-Mexico border, with the city of Presidio, Texas, directly opposite, on the U.S. side of the border. Oji ...[text shortened]... ument, use saxophones and accordions together to create a uniquely Ojinaga-styled norteño music.
    Are you saying they plan to share power between the two towns?
    Wonder when the drug cartels will take over that peaceful town?
  9. 19 Apr '10 09:12
    no, i much doubt it.

    the town's probably already affected by the drug trade.

    i just thought you'd be interested in the guitar aspect.
  10. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    19 Apr '10 12:55
    Originally posted by zeeblebot
    no, i much doubt it.

    the town's probably already affected by the drug trade.

    i just thought you'd be interested in the guitar aspect.
    Ah, yes I was interested in that aspect. Wish I knew what we could do about the drug trade, so violent they threaten the Mexican army.
  11. 19 Apr '10 16:45
    wall off the border.

    ban auto/truck traffic across the border.

    transparencize cross-border shipping and commutes.
  12. Standard member sonhouse
    Fast and Curious
    22 Apr '10 18:42
    Originally posted by zeeblebot
    wall off the border.

    ban auto/truck traffic across the border.

    transparencize cross-border shipping and commutes.
    Invent a ray gun that zaps drugs to carbon but lets humans go free. That would kill the trade real fast when they try to cross the border with the death powders.