@ponderable saidWho isolated them?
Seems like it is registration only now...probably too much data-transfer.
This article, which I think has been linked before claims the isolation:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7239045/
The article I posted where the database was referenced has been doing analysis of about 40 isolates in that database.
That is all I am asking. Is that too much to ask?
I know that China claimed it isolated the first SARS2 virus, but it has been alleged that it copied the vast majority from the SARS1 genome. Perhaps it is because that vast majority of that is the same, but how do we know for sure? It is a fair question to ask.
@Metal-Brain
This group I put in the end of the post did for example. Contact information is in the header of the article I had linked. For a person who claims to be superior to (at least nearly) all other posters here you show a distinct inability to understand the most basic elements of how scientific discussion is done.
If you want to discuss any method you should at least be able to understand what the method is about, and what the criteria to apply the methods are. Standing there and saying "I saw no proof" is just not cutting it. And asking who isolated the virus if you get served (not the first time) an article with a group of scientist claiming just that, is about as low level as it gets.
I know you won't believe any way until the guys who tell you that "nothing is proven" say otherwise. And all of them. Otherwise there is the one or other who doesn't and you will claim that this one is right due to some credentials you won't accept in the majority of people who do not concur with you...
So lets have a challenge: Show me that the majority of Nobel Prize winners claim that there has been no isolates on the virus (not any odd one out). You can't since the majority of them won't even bother to make any comment on the matter. Not because they would believe that it hasn't been done.
Jennifer Harcourt, Ph.D,1,* Azaibi Tamin, Ph.D,1,* Xiaoyan Lu,1 Shifaq Kamili,2 Senthil Kumar. Sakthivel,2 Janna Murray,2 Krista Queen, Ph.D.,1 Ying Tao, Ph.D.,1 Clinton R. Paden, Ph.D.,1 Jing Zhang,3 Yan Li,1 Anna Uehara, Ph.D.,4 Haibin Wang,3 Cynthia Goldsmith, Ph.D.,1 Hannah A. Bullock, Ph.D.,5 Lijuan Wang,5 Brett Whitaker,1 Brian Lynch,2 Rashi Gautam, Ph.D,1 Craig Schindewolf,6 Kumari G. Lokugamage, Ph.D,6 Dionna Scharton,7 Jessica A. Plante, Ph.D,7 Divya Mirchandani,6 Steven G. Widen, Ph.D.,8 Krishna Narayanan, Ph.D.,6 Shinji Makino, Ph.D.,6 Thomas G. Ksiazek, DVM, Ph.D,7,9 Kenneth S. Plante, Ph.D.,7 Scott C. Weaver, Ph.D.,6,7,9 Stephen Lindstrom, Ph.D,1 Suxiang Tong, Ph.D,1 Vineet D. Menachery, Ph.D,7,9,+ and Natalie J. Thornburg1,+
Author information Copyright and License information Disclaimer
1Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, Atlanta, GA, USA
2Eagle Contracting, Atlanta GA, USA
3IHRC, Atlanta GA, USA
4ORISE, Oak Ridge TN
5Synergy America, Inc., Atlanta GA, USA
6Department of Microbiology and Immunology, Institute for Human Infection and Immunity, University of Texas Medical Branch, Galveston TX, USA
7World Reference Center for Emerging Viruses and Arboviruses, Institute for Human Infection and Immunity, University of Texas Medical Branch, Galveston TX, USA
8Department of Biochemistry & Molecular Biology, Institute for Human Infection and Immunity, University of Texas Medical Branch, Galveston TX, USA
9Department of Pathology, Institute for Human Infection and Immunity, University of Texas Medical Branch, Galveston TX, USA
@ponderable saidSo asking who isolated an important virus is inappropriate? I must have a lot of nerve to ask such a simple question then. How dare I expect an answer.
@Metal-Brain
This group I put in the end of the post did for example. Contact information is in the header of the article I had linked. For a person who claims to be superior to (at least nearly) all other posters here you show a distinct inability to understand the most basic elements of how scientific discussion is done.
If you want to discuss any method you shoul ...[text shortened]... y, Institute for Human Infection and Immunity, University of Texas Medical Branch, Galveston TX, USA
Are you rejecting the allegation because of incredulity alone? Has it ever occurred to you that nobody is willing to ask a question that would be rejected by incredulity by almost everyone? A person would have to open themselves up to ridicule and still never receive an answer to the question. It is not the best career move regardless of the merits.
I am merely asking a fair question that is easy to answer if you have an answer. Do you feel comfortable with never getting an answer? If it was the US military why don't they just say that? There is no reason to keep it a secret. That is the US military's job, right? We should be disturbed if they did not isolate it.
Why is it a secret? Would it reveal that the US military is not doing their damn job?
@metal-brain saidIt is not inappropriate to ask it, but is HIGHLY inappropriate to be stubborn without reason.
So asking who isolated an important virus is inappropriate? I must have a lot of nerve to ask such a simple question then. How dare I expect an answer.
Are you rejecting the allegation because of incredulity alone? Has it ever occurred to you that nobody is willing to ask a question that would be rejected by incredulity by almost everyone? A person would have to open t ...[text shortened]... solate it.
Why is it a secret? Would it reveal that the US military is not doing their damn job?
But for the sake of discussion.
The authors of the now third time quoted article:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7239045/
write in describing figure 1D: micrograph of virus isolate. So you have even your quote pointed at.
Now please tell me : what exactly did the researchers wrong in your opinion. Which method would be improved or has been applied wrongly?
Hint: If you are unable to read a scientific text at all, please refrain from trying to tell us, that you are the only one who gets things right.
@ponderable saidExpecting an answer to what you admit is an appropriate question is HIGHLY inappropriate and stubborn without reason?
It is not inappropriate to ask it, but is HIGHLY inappropriate to be stubborn without reason.
But for the sake of discussion.
The authors of the now third time quoted article:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7239045/
write in describing figure 1D: micrograph of virus isolate. So you have even your quote pointed at.
Now please tell me : wh ...[text shortened]... text at all, please refrain from trying to tell us, that you are the only one who gets things right.
That is contradictory.
@ponderable said"please refrain from trying to tell us, that you are the only one who gets things right."
It is not inappropriate to ask it, but is HIGHLY inappropriate to be stubborn without reason.
But for the sake of discussion.
The authors of the now third time quoted article:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7239045/
write in describing figure 1D: micrograph of virus isolate. So you have even your quote pointed at.
Now please tell me : wh ...[text shortened]... text at all, please refrain from trying to tell us, that you are the only one who gets things right.
What did you get right?
@metal-brain saidhttps://asm.org/Articles/2020/October/SARS-CoV-2-Sequencing-Data-The-Devil-Is-in-the-Gen
Those are images, not a genetic sequence.
Irrelevant.
If nothing else just read the first few lines. Whole genome sequencing has long since been done for the virus. Perhaps in the early days there was some computerized corner-cutting to get a fast preliminary read on the virus's genome. You cite some statement from the CDC dating back to June 2020 on page 1 here, which in turn referred to research dating a few months earlier still -- when the virus had only just been discovered. You're way out of date, to put things charitably.
The SARS-CoV-2 virus has been genetically sequenced the same as any previously known virus has. The only difference is that this virus is political for you.
@ponderable saidThis virus has become political. Thus all the long-accepted tenets of epidemiology, pathology and virology that have served humanity so admirably for generations must now be called out as fake in service to the latter-day right-wing agenda. See also: owning the libs.
It is not inappropriate to ask it, but is HIGHLY inappropriate to be stubborn without reason.
But for the sake of discussion.
The authors of the now third time quoted article:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7239045/
write in describing figure 1D: micrograph of virus isolate. So you have even your quote pointed at.
Now please tell me : wh ...[text shortened]... text at all, please refrain from trying to tell us, that you are the only one who gets things right.
@soothfast said"Thus all the long-accepted tenets of epidemiology"
This virus has become political. Thus all the long-accepted tenets of epidemiology, pathology and virology that have served humanity so admirably for generations must now be called out as fake in service to the latter-day right-wing agenda. See also: owning the libs.
Not all epidemiology has been long accepted evidence. You are making it up. Telling people to do several different things and giving credit to one of them is not evidence, it is flawed science and science acknowledges that.
@soothfast saidThere are thousands of articles that anybody can post that says those things. Parroting what others say is not really evidence.
https://asm.org/Articles/2020/October/SARS-CoV-2-Sequencing-Data-The-Devil-Is-in-the-Gen
If nothing else just read the first few lines. Whole genome sequencing has long since been done for the virus. Perhaps in the early days there was some computerized corner-cutting to get a fast preliminary read on the virus's genome. You cite some statement from the CDC dating bac ...[text shortened]... ame as any previously known virus has. The only difference is that this virus is political for you.
I don't know which variant you think proves something, but regardless of which one it is all you have to do is show me who isolated it and if they sequenced the whole genome without cutting corners.
Also, even a complete genetic sequence of the virus does not prove it has been isolated. Has the SARS2 virus been Isolated According to Koch’s Postulates or River’s Postulates?
https://www.fluoridefreepeel.ca/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/FOI-and-formal-responses-re-covid19-virus-isolation-purification-from-19-institutions-Oct-10-2020.pdf
@metal-brain said"Has SARS-CoV-2 been isolated?"
There are thousands of articles that anybody can post that says those things. Parroting what others say is not really evidence.
I don't know which variant you think proves something, but regardless of which one it is all you have to do is show me who isolated it and if they sequenced the whole genome without cutting corners.
Also, even a complete genetic sequence of ...[text shortened]... OI-and-formal-responses-re-covid19-virus-isolation-purification-from-19-institutions-Oct-10-2020.pdf
1. Why do you need to know this?
2. Why is the answer so important to you that you've rejected so many answers out of hand?
3. It's OK to keep asking, but at some point you have to either be satisfied with an answer or decide that obtaining a satisfactory answer is not important enough to ruin your life over. Personally I'd go for that last option.
@kewpie saidThis link took a while to upload, but it shows something.
"Has SARS-CoV-2 been isolated?"
1. Why do you need to know this?
2. Why is the answer so important to you that you've rejected so many answers out of hand?
3. It's OK to keep asking, but at some point you have to either be satisfied with an answer or decide that obtaining a satisfactory answer is not important enough to ruin your life over. Personally I'd go for that last option.
https://www.fluoridefreepeel.ca/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/FOI-and-formal-responses-re-covid19-virus-isolation-purification-from-19-institutions-Oct-10-2020.pdf
I have to get an answer to be satisfied with one. It will not ruin my life asking a good question. Stop being ridiculously dramatic.
@metal-brain saidSo if it's important to you, go find some real experts. A public entertainment forum isn't where you should be looking.
This link took a while to upload, but it shows something.
https://www.fluoridefreepeel.ca/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/FOI-and-formal-responses-re-covid19-virus-isolation-purification-from-19-institutions-Oct-10-2020.pdf
I have to get an answer to be satisfied with one. It will not ruin my life asking a good question. Stop being ridiculously dramatic.
@metal-brain saidCongratulations.
This link took a while to upload, but it shows something.
https://www.fluoridefreepeel.ca/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/FOI-and-formal-responses-re-covid19-virus-isolation-purification-from-19-institutions-Oct-10-2020.pdf
I have to get an answer to be satisfied with one. It will not ruin my life asking a good question. Stop being ridiculously dramatic.
So you are looking for crytallized virus? Why don't you say so? You always reffered to "islaotes" which is a well defined technical term, and yes the definition is not what you think...
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10930-020-09933-w
Is a link to crytsall of the virus. Isolated enough for you?
@ponderable saidThose are just structures of the SARS-CoV-2 and you don't know what isolated means. Go back to the debates forum where you belong.
Congratulations.
So you are looking for crytallized virus? Why don't you say so? You always reffered to "islaotes" which is a well defined technical term, and yes the definition is not what you think...
https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10930-020-09933-w
Is a link to crytsall of the virus. Isolated enough for you?