Originally posted by Eladar You are hopeless. You have no desire to be educated, you simply want to feel good about knowing it all.
You have no desire to look at anything that challenges your religious beliefs.
Good luck.
You have no desire to be educated,
you mean by you? You haven't given me anything to learn for there appears to be nothing educational presented in your posts for someone with my level of science knowledge. I am most probably better educated than you in biology, physics, chemistry and surely most sciences including nutrition. I have successfully done a number of university and collage science courses some to an advanced level and have intensely studied science for most of my life. I am still learning for, on most days, I usually learn some new scientific fact and, these days, usually from a science web link. So, have you done any of the same? Would you claim to understand or know more about science than I do and, if so, what would the bases of this claim be?
do you dispute any of the facts I stated in my last post? if so, which ones and in what way are they wrong? and, if you don't despite them, why don't you learn them? -I mean, have you no desire to be "educated"? 😛
you mean by you? You haven't given me anything to learn for there appears to be nothing educational presented in your posts for someone with my level of science knowledge. I am most probably better educated than you in biology, physics, chemistry and surely most sciences including nutrition. I have succe ...[text shortened]... u don't despite them, why don't you learn them? -I mean, have you no desire to be "educated"? 😛
but have you formulated any original ideas Humy, you see its one thing to read and assimilate knowledge from other people, to identify the thief once he is caught so to speak, but quite another to catch him in the first place 😀 I mean this not as a challenge but as a general inquiry for it might be that you have discovered something that i would not understand, i had a friend like that, Gavin McNay, he was a brilliant mathematician in number theory, wrote a treatise and flew to Russia and America explaining it to about half a dozen people who knew what he was talking about. Apart from that he was quite normal.
you mean by you? You haven't given me anything to learn for there appears to be nothing educational presented in your posts for someone with my level of science knowledge. I am most probably better educated than you in biology, physics, chemistry and surely most sciences including nutrition. I have succe ...[text shortened]... u don't despite them, why don't you learn them? -I mean, have you no desire to be "educated"? 😛
Do I dispute any of the 'facts' that you believe?
I love this thread. I post a study, then you say the study is wrong based on your beliefs, then ask if I can refute your beliefs. Of course I can't refute a belief. I can only post a study which is at odds with your beliefs.
Do a little research on how a high carb diet can and does effect hormones in your body.
Originally posted by Eladar Do I dispute any of the 'facts' that you believe?
I love this thread. I post a study, then you say the study is wrong based on your beliefs, then ask if I can refute your beliefs. Of course I can't refute a belief. I can only post a study which is at odds with your beliefs.
Do a little research on how a high carb diet can and does effect hormones in your body.
Do a little research on how a high carb diet can and does effect hormones in your body.
Why? What has that got to do with my claims? I already know about that. Did I ever say/imply that eating too much carbohydrates is no bad for you? 😛 If so, please state where....
You can be vegetarian and have a high proportion of grains in your diet without obesity or any adverse effects. So your point is...?
Ok, perhaps you can help me with one thing you claimed:
Fortified cereals are a valid reason why grains are a good source of nutrition. Tell me why I should ingest grains that have vitamins added and not simply take vitamins? How does adding vitamins make the grains a good source of nutrition, if it is the vitamins that are the source of nutrition not the grains
Originally posted by Eladar Wow, I need to attack your claims?
I suppose your claims must be accepted as fact.
Ok, perhaps you can help me with one thing you claimed:
Fortified cereals are a valid reason why grains are a good source of nutrition. Tell me why I should ingest grains that have vitamins added and not simply take vitamins? How does adding vitamins make the grains ...[text shortened]... good source of nutrition, if it is the vitamins that are the source of nutrition not the grains
Possible explanation as to why people who consume large amounts of grains might have a lower quality of life:
Mycotoxin poisoning is called mycotoxicosis. The higher levels of mycotoxin contamination can affect the central nervous system, cardiovascular system, kidney, gastrointestinal system and immune system depending upon the type and stage of the animal. The mycotoxins that are a significant concern to both humans as well as animals are aflatoxins, fumonisin, vomitoxin, zearalenone and T-2 toxins.
http://www.drjohntafel.com/?page_id=619
Corn is “universally contaminated” with fumonisin and other fungal toxins such as aflatoxin, zearalenone and ochratoxin (Council for Agricultural Science and Technology. Mycotoxins: Risks in Plant, Animal and Human Systems. Task Force Report No. 139. Ames, IA. Jan 2003). Fumonisin and aflatoxin are known for their cancer-causing effects, while zearalenone and ochratoxin cause estrogenic and kidney-related problems, respectively. Just as corn is universally contaminated with mycotoxins, our food supply seems to be universally contaminated with corn–it’s everywhere!
[b]Mycotoxin poisoning is called mycotoxicosis. The higher levels of mycotoxin contamination can affect the central nervous system, cardiovascular system, kidney, ...[text shortened]... mycotoxins, our food supply seems to be universally contaminated with corn–it’s everywhere![/b]
An explanation from simply dumping sugar on your body:
•Eating many high-glycemic-index foods – which cause powerful spikes in blood sugar – can lead to an increased risk for type 2 diabetes, (2) heart disease, (3), (4) and overweight, (5,6) (7). There is also preliminary work linking high-glycemic diets to age-related macular degeneration, (8) ovulatory infertility, (9) and colorectal cancer. (10)
Originally posted by Eladar Wow, I need to attack your claims?
I suppose your claims must be accepted as fact.
Ok, perhaps you can help me with one thing you claimed:
Fortified cereals are a valid reason why grains are a good source of nutrition. Tell me why I should ingest grains that have vitamins added and not simply take vitamins? How does adding vitamins make the grains ...[text shortened]... good source of nutrition, if it is the vitamins that are the source of nutrition not the grains
Fortified cereals are a valid reason why grains are a good source of nutrition.
Extreme straw man. This is obviously not one of the things I said/implied and not one of my claims and never was as it is so obviously a false inference. It is also grammatically sloppy if not pretty vague - a “valid reason”? should be stated as “logical reason to believe” assuming that is what you meant. And what scientific criteria determines whether something is a “GOOD source of nutrition”? Is how much “nutrition” something is something that can be scientifically measured and, if so, what units of measurement are used and how many of these units it must have before it is scientifically defined as a “good” source on nutrition? Surely, how much “nutrition” something has is dependent on context and exactly how you define the word. Can 'how nutritious' be mathematically just defined by the calorie content or can it be mathematically defined by the variety of nutrients or what exactly?
So, are you implying (from your later posts which are totally irrelevant to any of my claims and anything I said because I never said eating to much sugar is 'good' for health 😛 ) a diet with a relatively 'high' proportion ( say for the sake of argument, 40%. if not, how high is high? ) of grains is 'bad' for health ( however you would scientifically define 'bad' in this context ) even if your total calorie intake is not too much i.e. not enough to make you overweight? point: -if you are trying to make an argument why we all should eat meat, you haven't! You are not even getting close to constructing such an argument!
Fortified cereals are a valid reason why grains are a good source of nutrition.
Extreme straw man. This is obviously not one of the things I said/implied and not one of my claims and never was as it is so obviously a false inference. It is also grammatically sloppy if not pretty vague - a “valid reason”? should be stated as “logical rea ...[text shortened]... l should eat meat, you haven't! You are not even getting close to constructing such an argument!
I'm not making the argument to eat meat, just avoid grains.
There is absolutely no reason to eat grains and multiple reason to avoid them.
As for not being fat, did you even read the link I gave concerning the bmi?
Originally posted by Eladar I'm not making the argument to eat meat, just avoid grains.
There is absolutely no reason to eat grains and multiple reason to avoid them.
As for not being fat, did you even read the link I gave concerning the bmi?
I'm not making the argument to eat meat, just avoid grains.
There is no rational reason to avoid grains. A diet that has grains in it can be perfectly healthy as many scientific links would confirm some of which I have already given. In fact, it has been shown that healthy diets typically contain some grains although grains are not absolutely essential for good health because they can be substituted for such things as potato, peas etc ( and without the need for meat ) .
As for the other links you gave, they are all irrelevant to what I say here for I clearly did I say that if you eat too much of any one food, it will not harm your health and a certainly don't claim, as you keep repeatedly imply, that eating lots of sugar is harmless to health! You just keep on endlessly repeating the same old worn out straw mans.
Eating too much of any one food or any one food-group would be harmful to health and that includes both meat and grains -so? so what? I already knew this and never said/implied it isn't true.
I'm not making the argument to eat meat, just avoid grains.
There is no rational reason to avoid grains. A diet that has grains in it can be perfectly healthy as many scientific links would confirm some of which I have already given. In fact, it has been shown that healthy diets typically contain some grains although grains are not absolu ...[text shortened]... des both meat and grains -so? so what? I already knew this and never said/implied it isn't true.
No rational reason to avoid grains?
I guess some science you believe is rational, while other science is irrational.
Originally posted by Eladar No rational reason to avoid grains?
I guess some science you believe is rational, while other science is irrational.
I don't reject ANY science. No science claims that we should not eat any grains for good health -only that we shouldn't eat too much of any one food if we want to be of optimal health and that includes meat and grains.
So far you haven't shown a single link that says otherwise i.e you haven't shown a link that says we should eat NO grains for optimum health, only that, just like any other food including meat, we should not eat too much grain -which is extremely unsurprising and obviously I already knew that! You can eat too much of ANY food! Even pure roughage!
Originally posted by humy I don't reject ANY science. No science claims that we should not eat any grains for good health -only that we shouldn't eat too much of any one food if we want to be of optimal health and that includes meat and grains.
So far you haven't shown a single link that says otherwise i.e you haven't shown a link that says we should eat NO grains for optimum health, o ...[text shortened]... prising and obviously I already knew that! You can eat too much of ANY food! Even pure roughage!
Where does science say that you must eat grains to be healthy?
Originally posted by humy Strew man. I didn't say this. read my posts again.
It isn't a straw man. I've already linked stories about why grains can be bad for you. They are a source of toxins and can lead to health problems even if the toxins do not exist.
Why introduce the risk if they are not needed? If people are having blood sugar problems, why are grains still immune to being questioned?
Vegetarians Less Healthy, Lower Quality Of Life
09 Apr '14 16:436 edits
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