New forum needed?

How about a forum for the subscribers here that want to talk about clan related s̶h̶i̶t̶ stuff?
It should be a subscriber-only forum (after all, only subs can belong to clans) and could therefore be free from (normal) moderation.

You'd need to agree to enter (not just browse by chance) with the proviso that you agree to be potentially offended by joining. Maybe membership of a clan would be required before joining.

... I can see the general forum suffering otherwise.

Originally posted by orangutan
How about a forum for the subscribers here that want to talk about clan related stuff?
It should be a subscriber-only forum (after all, only subs can belong to clans) and could therefore be free from (normal) moderation.

You'd need to agree to enter (not just browse by chance) with the proviso that you agree to be potentially offended by joining. Maybe ...[text shortened]... a clan would be required before joining.

... I can see the general forum suffering otherwise.

I think you've just described the currently-suspended Clans forum, haven't you, with the one difference that only subscribers can take part.

I don't think that will make any difference at all, because hardly any, if any, non-subscribers took part in the Clans forum.

The Clans forum has not been suspended because non-subscribers joined in. I don't think they did. It's been suspended because there is, within RHP, an unresolved situation which affected clans mostly but also, actually, every single player on the site, particularly but not only, those at the lower end of the rating scale.

Until that situation is effectively addressed the problem's going to remain, and is bound to re-emerge one way or another.

Actually, it's very simple. This site is a community. Every community needs to function within acceptable parameters. It's a basic policing matter.

If a member commits serious offences and is not dealt with, then the whole community is the worse off.

Your new forum idea is no different, really, from what we've had. It's not the forum at fault, nor the vast majority of its members. It's the lack of policing of flagrant misdemeanours.

Originally posted by Startreader
I think you've just described the currently-suspended Clans forum, haven't you, with the one difference that only subscribers can take part.

I don't think that will make any difference at all, because hardly any, if any, non-subscribers took part in the Clans forum.

The Clans forum has not been suspended because non-subscribers joined in. I don't ...[text shortened]... ault, nor the vast majority of its members. It's the lack of policing of flagrant misdemeanours.

I can't say I ever got involved with the clans forum, but from the brief reads I have made, I'd deduce that everyone there is a gay, homophobic cheater - that seems to be the general thrust of what gets said.

My idea is not just to limit it to subs - but to allow it to go un-moderated - much like a club forum. I know club admins can kick users & delete posts - but having someone "in charge" is obviously going to be contentious - so maybe just leave it free.
If you clan focused people want to "taunt, ridicule and goad" then by all means go for it. Just don't bring the general forum down with that - that was my idea.

From reading what's been posted on the GF it seems that the Clan forum imploded due to excessive alerts to the moderators.
I'm saying reinstate the forum to allow the outlet for clan based taunts - but keep it away from public view and by some sort of extra opt-in (i.e sub with a clan & agree to the consequences) ... and free from bothering the moderators.

Originally posted by orangutan
I can't say I ever got involved with the clans forum, but from the brief reads I have made, I'd deduce that everyone there is a gay, homophobic cheater - that seems to be the general thrust of what gets said.

My idea is not just to limit it to subs - but to allow it to go un-moderated - much like a club forum. I know club admins can kick users & delete ...[text shortened]... in (i.e sub with a clan & agree to the consequences) ... and free from bothering the moderators.

No, most people don't want to continually taunt, ridicule and goad. That description was created by the site, and has been misused by, mostly, one member.

Certainly most people do not want to cheat. Quite the opposite. The current problem has arisen because very serious cheating and manipulation was not thoroughly dealt with by the site, and people are angry.

I don't agree that it should go unmoderated.

Originally posted by Startreader
No, most people don't want to continually taunt, ridicule and goad. That description was created by the site, and has been misused by, mostly, one member.

Certainly most people do not want to cheat. Quite the opposite. The current problem has arisen because very serious cheating and manipulation was not thoroughly dealt with by the site, and people are angry.

I don't agree that it should go unmoderated.

Like I say - I'm not up with the details not having been a devotee of that forum - but from the few times I did stray there - it was always pretty taunty, goady and ridiculey.
The clan forum has always seemed a tad aggressive.

All I'm suggesting is that if you want it to continue - then make it a not-for-public consumption thing. The alternative would seem to be that your only outlet would be swamping the general forum.

Originally posted by orangutan
Like I say - I'm not up with the details not having been a devotee of that forum - but from the few times I did stray there - it was always pretty taunty, goady and ridiculey.
The clan forum has always seemed a tad aggressive.

All I'm suggesting is that if you want it to continue - then make it a not-for-public consumption thing. The alternative would seem to be that your only outlet would be swamping the general forum.

It's a matter of public concern. It affects everyone if a player disrespects the site and breaches the TOS while dishonestly manipulating the whole rating system to his own advantage.

The Clans forum was fine as it was. Particular circumstances brought about the current situation and those posting respectfully about the problem surely have every right to post about it in the General forum? Particularly since the actual problem is relevant to every single player on this site, in or out of a clan.

Originally posted by orangutan
Like I say - I'm not up with the details not having been a devotee of that forum - but from the few times I did stray there - it was always pretty taunty, goady and ridiculey.
The clan forum has always seemed a tad aggressive.

All I'm suggesting is that if you want it to continue - then make it a not-for-public consumption thing. The alternative would seem to be that your only outlet would be swamping the general forum.

I tend to agree with you there dude. What you have described is exactly what I was thinking. Enter at own risk stuff, no alerts button. Startreader has a point about the cheating thing though but matters like that could be handled separately. Bring on the no holds barred forum.

Originally posted by Startreader
It's a matter of public concern. It affects everyone if a player disrespects the site and breaches the TOS while dishonestly manipulating the whole rating system to his own advantage.

The Clans forum was fine as it was. Particular circumstances brought about the current situation and those posting respectfully about the problem surely have every rig ...[text shortened]... y since the actual problem is relevant to every single player on this site, in or out of a clan.

Wut? Who said anything about the rating system or what a player does / did with regard to the TOS? I was talking about the recent removal of the Clan forum and a possible replacement.
I'll say it again - I'm not up to speed with whatever was going on in the Clans forum. Frankly - I don't care. Whatever arguments and bickering caused the implosion is really not my concern.

I'm not sure that non-clan members give a hoot that your forum has been shut down - yet. They may do when all the posters from there are denied an outlet and so spill their vitriol into the general forum.

I'm suggesting that you get your forum back - and without moderation. You can then abuse yourselves as much as you like - just have a door policy that acknowledges it. Subs only and some sort of "i agree that I may offended" tick-box to enter.

Originally posted by radioactive69
I tend to agree with you there dude. What you have described is exactly what I was thinking. Enter at own risk stuff, no alerts button. Startreader has a point about the cheating thing though but matters like that could be handled separately. Bring on the no holds barred forum.

Cheating is cheating and not limited to clans.
That's a whole other horrible thing that needs addressing - but how to square that circle is a big ball-ache of a nasty wassit that's going to take a bigger ̶m̶̶o̶n̶k̶e̶y̶ ape than me to sort out.

Originally posted by orangutan
Wut? Who said anything about the rating system or what a player does / did with regard to the TOS? I was talking about the recent removal of the Clan forum and a possible replacement.
I'll say it again - I'm not up to speed with whatever was going on in the Clans forum. Frankly - I don't care. Whatever arguments and bickering caused the implosion is reall ...[text shortened]... hat acknowledges it. Subs only and some sort of "i agree that I may offended" tick-box to enter.

I understand that you don't know what's been going on.

In fact, an instance of planned detailed cheating and breach of TOS are what has brought about this situation. Administrative action wasn't taken, and I've just learned it's beginning all over again.

Originally posted by orangutan
Wut? Who said anything about the rating system or what a player does / did with regard to the TOS? I was talking about the recent removal of the Clan forum and a possible replacement.
I'll say it again - I'm not up to speed with whatever was going on in the Clans forum. Frankly - I don't care. Whatever arguments and bickering caused the implosion is reall ...[text shortened]... hat acknowledges it. Subs only and some sort of "i agree that I may offended" tick-box to enter.

There are many such forums on the internet. Do we really need such a place on a chess site? Would such a forum enhance the reputation of RHP? ,

The clan system is a very competitive system. You've probably not played much sport but if you had you would know that tempers flair which brings out the best in players. At the end of the game everyone shakes hands and have a beer together. So ...yes....we do need such a forum. There's enough cutie pie forums for the rest of you

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
There are many such forums on the internet. Do we really need such a place on a chess site? Would such a forum enhance the reputation of RHP? ,

I'd say we do.
We've had a clans forum here for a long time.

What I'm suggesting is that we put it back again - but in a place where only those who really want to go have access.Possibly have a link that can only be used from a clan home-page - if you're in a clan then you can go there - if not then you can't.

Right now there are two types of forum at RHP - the public ones which are all moderated by volunteers and the private ones which are run by whoever is the admin for that club / clan.

The public forums are visible to the whole interwebnets - anyone can see the content but only registered users of RHP can add to them, thumb and alert etc. These forums should continue to be moderated to maintain the sites rep.

The private forums however can only be seem by their members. They don't show anywhere else on the web and so they don't need moderation in the same way.
It looks to me like the clan forum was shut because of an abuse of the alert system? If that's the case then accept that things get heated there and let them get on with it.

Clearly there's a need for a clan based forum here - as the old one was a pretty popular place if I recall rightly. The alternative is to have all that clan-based "banter" spill into the general forum. It might "liven" the place up for a while, but it'll get old pretty quickly and isn't that why the different forums were created in the first place - to keep all that stuff separate?

Originally posted by orangutan
I'd say we do.
We've had a clans forum here for a long time.

What I'm suggesting is that we put it back again - but in a place where only those who really want to go have access.Possibly have a link that can only be used from a clan home-page - if you're in a clan then you can go there - if not then you can't.

Right now there are two types of forum ...[text shortened]... that why the different forums were created in the first place - to keep all that stuff separate?

Couldn't agree more with you brother. Summed up to perfection.

If you want a private clans forum, would this work?

1. Start a new clan and name it the "forum clan", or some other name that suits you.
2. Whoever starts it is the leader and the policy is that it is a forum only. No clan games.
3. Send out a pm to all prospective participants and invite them to apply for membership, advising that it is only for the purpose of having a private forum.
4. Have those who join pass the word along throughout the clans community using pm's, for any clan members who are interested to apply.

There you go. You would now have your private forum with no moderators except for whoever moderates the normal private clan forum.

I have not been in a clan for ages so have to make some assumptions here:
(I assume that a clan forum moderator would be the person who created the clan, right? The clan leader.)
(I also assume that the regular forum moderators have nothing to do with clan forums.)
(Lastly, I assume that only subscribers can join a clan so your forum clan will be for subscribers only.)