@ sumydid

Originally posted by sumydid
Well since you've staked claim to being part of the group, then I'll list a few things that your group does consistently. Then, you can either separate yourself from the group and condemn those actions, or, embrace their actions and confirm yourself as one of them.

The Secular Liberal Progressives, in the United States, have shown a consistent pattern of the same conclusions since the pattern has been well known for a very long time.

Let's have a look at this then -

- hatred for traditional family values

I don't have hatred for anything, let alone 'traditional family values', whatever that maybe.

- disgust, if not full-blown hatred for all things and all people, Christian

Again, i don't have hatred for anything. I have pity, which sometimes comes across as disdain, for fundamentalism. That's reserved for fundamentalism of all religions.

- complete disagreement with anything a Conservative politician has to say

I would disagree with lots that a Conservative politician has to say, but not everything.

- complete agreement with anything a Liberal politician has to say

I would agree with lots that a Liberal politician has to say, but not everything.

- a strong attraction toward Socialism, Marxism, Communism, and/or Statism

Can't say i have a strong attraction to them really, although if you ask me do i think the state should play a role in society, i would answer yes.

- a strong dislike for Capitalism and Free Enterprise

I have a strong dislike for the unfettered laissez-faire capitalism that's running amok at the moment.

- disdain and lack of respect for traditional American values and the Constitution

That doesn't apply to me, i live in the UK.

- convenient alliances with Feminists, gay rights advocates, labor unions, college professors and teachers, Hollywood, abortion rights activists, and other special interest groups

Nah, i don't have a convenient alliance with anyone, except with my girlfriend.

- (edit: possibly feigned) support, sympathy, and/or compassion for all Muslims, including fanatics

Nope. I judge a human being by the content of their heart and that alone. I have a simple question/rule i follow - Is that person a knobhead? Yes or no. That's the only distinction i make.

Originally posted by Proper Knob
Let's have a look at this then -

[b]- hatred for traditional family values

I don't have hatred for anything, let alone 'traditional family values', whatever that maybe.

- disgust, if not full-blown hatred for all things and all people, Christian

Again, i don't have hatred for anything. I have pity, which sometimes comes across as i follow - Is that person a knobhead? Yes or no. That's the only distinction i make.[/b]

as a free thinking liberal I must agree with these sentiments with the exception that you should marry the girl.

Originally posted by sumydid
The Secular Liberal Progressives, in the United States, have shown a consistent pattern of...

- hatred for traditional family values Not at all. I think my own family is pretty traditional, as it happens, as are the family lives of pretty much all my relatives. I suppose I am tolerant of families that are not traditional in the same way as mine as long as the kids are loved and raised with integrity.

- disgust, if not full-blown hatred for all things and all people, Christian Not at all. Sociologically speaking I have lived a Christian life in Christian social contexts, to this day, although I no longer subscribe to Christian beliefs (having been one for more or less 28 years). Disgust? No. Full-blown hatred? No. I'm not entirely convinced you are being particularly smart by using hyperbole of this kind to define something.

- complete disagreement with anything a Conservative politician has to say Complete disagreement? No. I am quite interested in what Conservative politicians say and I am probably more conservative now than I have been at any time during the last 30 years of adult life. Wording your criterion as "complete disagreement" seems a bit silly, if I may say.

- complete agreement with anything a Liberal politician has to say Complete agreement? No, not at all. I rather think it is an intellectual flaw on your part to have used the word "complete" like this.

- a strong attraction toward Socialism, Marxism, Communism, and/or Statism No, not at all. I am probably best described as a social democrat.

- a strong dislike for Capitalism and Free Enterprise Not at all. I am self-employed and, for all intents and purposes, an entrepreneur. I make full use of the market mechanism to charge what I want for the services I provide and I enjoy the freedom it gives me to sometimes charge as little as I can or want. Indeed it means I can sometimes work pro bono.

- disdain and lack of respect for traditional American values and the Constitution I am British and have lived in several places around the world over the last 20 years, but not including the U.S. So this criterion does not apply to me I suppose. I am a great admirer of many aspects of American culture and history, and I think the U.S. constitution is one of history's most magnificent documents.

- convenient alliances with Feminists, gay rights advocates, labor unions, college professors and teachers, Hollywood, abortion rights activists I don't have "alliances" with anyone. A certain amount of my work in connected to the furthering of human rights in the country where I live, and in support of the growing civil society here (which is finding its feet after 30 years of dictatorship). I do some university lecturing.

- support, sympathy, and compassion for all Muslims, including fanatics I live among Muslims and have many delightful friends. I have always condemned religious violence. I don't think Muslim theology represents a revelation of God any more or less than I think Christian theology does.

I really do wonder why you described me as a "Secular Liberal Progressive" on the other thread. The definition you yourself have provided just does not fit me at all. You seem rather prone to a heady mix of generalizing and being oddly hyperbolic at the same time.

Originally posted by sumydid
Well since you've staked claim to being part of the group, then I'll list a few things that your group does consistently. Then, you can either separate yourself from the group and condemn those actions, or, embrace their actions and confirm yourself as one of them.

The Secular Liberal Progressives, in the United States, have shown a consistent pattern of the same conclusions since the pattern has been well known for a very long time.

However, I have concluded that the reason for their support for Islam and disgust/hatred toward Christianity is because they see no harm in supporting something they think is silly and impossible; they align themselves in support of Islam as a matter of "enemy of my enemy is my friend" convenience; while Christianity has at least some semblance of credibility, thus exposing a vulnerability.
What a load of tosh! Christianity has the same amount of credibility as Islam, Scientology, or FSMism.

Originally posted by sumydid
Well since you've staked claim to being part of the group, then I'll list a few things that your group does consistently. Then, you can either separate yourself from the group and condemn those actions, or, embrace their actions and confirm yourself as one of them.

The Secular Liberal Progressives, in the United States, have shown a consistent pattern of ...[text shortened]... the same conclusions since the pattern has been well known for a very long time.

To confirm what Agerg has pointed out above (i didn't read that far down your post), i view Christianity and Islam in the same light. Mythology.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
as a free thinking liberal I must agree with these sentiments with the exception that you should marry the girl.

Liberal? LIBERAL??

Please.

Originally posted by sumydid
Well since you've staked claim to being part of the group, then I'll list a few things that your group does consistently. Then, you can either separate yourself from the group and condemn those actions, or, embrace their actions and confirm yourself as one of them.

The Secular Liberal Progressives, in the United States, have shown a consistent pattern of ...[text shortened]... the same conclusions since the pattern has been well known for a very long time.

This is disappointing.

You're throwing the baby out with the bathwater on several of these points.

I am as Liberal as they come, and yet I love America, and I took an oath to support and defend the US Constitution. Your point that liberals hate America is way, WAY off base. We love America and we hate what conservatives are trying to do to it, namely, turning Capitalism into the State-sponsored religion of America. Despite what Gordon Gekko said, Greed is NOT good. It is destroying America, just exactly like it destroyed the Soviet Union.

Originally posted by Proper Knob
[b]- convenient alliances with Feminists, gay rights advocates, labor unions, college professors and teachers, Hollywood, abortion rights activists, and other special interest groups

Nah, i don't have a convenient alliance with anyone, except with my girlfriend.

[/b]

Ok, now this made me LOL.

Originally posted by Suzianne
This is disappointing.

You're throwing the baby out with the bathwater on several of these points.

I am as Liberal as they come, and yet I love America, and I took an oath to support and defend the US Constitution. Your point that liberals hate America is way, WAY off base. We love America and we hate what conservatives are trying to do to it, namel ...[text shortened]... Greed is NOT good. It is destroying America, just exactly like it destroyed the Soviet Union.

Politically you are liberal, progressive and open. Religiously you are the opposite.
How intriguing. Surely it must create some inner conflict of attitude?
We align polltically, though I am not an American.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
wow, in that case, I am not a religious fundamentalist at all, but a free thinking
progressive secular liberal, simply because i contend that capitalism is built upon
exploitation and is a thoroughly unstable and corruptible entity, which has fomented a
spirit of materialism contrary to the teaching of the Christ and to the detriment of
spir ...[text shortened]... igious fundamentalist at all,
but a free thinking progressive secular liberal, praise da lord!

Um... I never said that anyone who matches anything I said, can't be Mormon, or a Christian, or anything else.

Where did THAT come from?

All I did was state common, well-known observations.

Originally posted by Agerg
What a load of tosh! Christianity has the same amount of credibility as Islam, Scientology, or FSMism.

Hogwash. If you really believed that, you would attack FSMism, Islam, Scientology, etc. with the same fervor as you attack Christianity.

Originally posted by Suzianne
This is disappointing.

You're throwing the baby out with the bathwater on several of these points.

I am as Liberal as they come, and yet I love America, and I took an oath to support and defend the US Constitution. Your point that liberals hate America is way, WAY off base. We love America and we hate what conservatives are trying to do to it, namel ...[text shortened]... Greed is NOT good. It is destroying America, just exactly like it destroyed the Soviet Union.

I was speaking specifically of the Secular Progressive movement we have in the United States. You can add the war on Christmas to the list, but that's already obvious, given their disgust with Christians and Christianity.

You are not a Secular Liberal Progressive, and you don't match the list of criteria. So, I don't see how you could possibly be disappointed, since the list has nothing to do with you.

Originally posted by FMF
- hatred for traditional family values [b]Not at all. I think my own family is pretty traditional, as it happens, as are the family lives of pretty much all my relatives. I suppose I am tolerant of families that are not traditional in the same way as mine as long as the kids are loved and raised with integrity.

- disgust, if not full-blown hatred for all er prone to a heady mix of generalizing and being oddly hyperbolic at the same time.[/b]

Great! You're not a Secular Progressive either. That's wonderful news. A lot of your thinking is in line with the SP movement, which I have stated before. But you're not one of them and I commend you for it. A lot of people belong to the group and they are shaping the country's political landscape, and future, in a very bad way.

Suzianne, I have gone to great lengths to both acknowledge your political Liberalism, and explain exactly what the SP's are all about. I even once pointed you to a wiki page that describes another group of people called "Liberal Christians." You took me to task for rebuking "Liberal Christian" Theology, because you are a Liberal and a Christian. I had to take the time to demonstrate and acknowledge: Yes, you are a Liberal. And yes, you are a Christian. But NO, you do not embrace Liberal Christian Theology.

And here we are again with me describing what the Secular Progressive Movement is all about here in the United States, and you have taken insult to my comments, as if I lumped you into the group. How could I possibly, by any stretch of the imagination, consider you a Secular Liberal Progressive, when the first word "Secular" expressly excludes all believers including Christians?

Folks, do a little research about the Progressive Movement in the US. President Woodrow Wilson championed the movement back in the early 1900's... and the people behind the movement were (and still are) big fans of the Western Europe, Socialist/Marxist model. Words like "Socialism," "Marxism," and "Communism" were not popular during those days, so the movement was named the "Progressive" movement, in order to cloak its Socialist agenda.

Many people then, and today, very much believe in Socialism and the Western Europe model. My brother is an outspoken proponent of it and he's not afraid to admit it. Most people within the movement speak privately about their Socialist leanings and preferences because the idea still hasn't reached a majority yet.

Major roadblocks for the movement in America include Conservatives, Christians, Traditionalists, Constitutionalists, and the new "Tea Party."

Most Secular Progressives believe the ends justify the means, and support false propaganda--if not outright lie themselves--in order to convince the uninformed that their Conservative, Christian, and Constitutionalist opponents are evil, old-fashioned, narrow-minded fools who are a dying breed.

The only POSSIBLE way to crush Capitalism and Free Enterprise (which are the very reasons this country rose to such heights in the first place), is to collapse the economy, break the spirit of the populace, and force them to come to the government for free stuff in order to live.

Well, Obama is well underway with this agenda. We now have 47 million people are in poverty and on Food Stamps; more than ever before. The REAL unemployment number in the US is about 36% according to CNN Money [ http://money.cnn.com/2012/05/03/news/economy/unemployment-rate/index.htm ] -- that ghastly number includes all the known unemployed citizens, as well as the 86 million "invisible" citizens that don't get counted as unemployed because they've given up and dropped out of the work force.

Obama is part and parcel to the Secular Progressive Movement and its agenda to establish a European model, Socialist-style state, and weaken the country so that it will no longer be looked to as a leader by the rest of the world. Obama believes (and readily admits it) in redistributing wealth, but what many don't realize is, that includes not only the rich Americans (giving their money to the government for socialist programs), but also the United States distributing its wealth and power to other countries.