A question for Christians

I have always believed that every human is born with a sin nature. I still do.
I have always believed that even though I confessed Jesus as Lord, Christians continue to have the sinful nature until we die or are changed.

Now I have been listening to a new bible teacher who says that when he was crucified with Christ, his old nature was crucified too.
The reason we Christians sin, is because we have not renewed our minds sufficiently.
The mind is like a computer and has to be programmed to believe what God says about us. I am intrigued with this thinking and the bible seems to agree as well.
The bible does say things like, We have the righteousness of God, and many other awesome things concerning this new birth. We just have to understand to believe it and apply it.
What do you think?

Bump for any Christian...

Originally posted by checkbaiter
I have always believed that every human is born with a sin nature. I still do.
I have always believed that even though I confessed Jesus as Lord, Christians continue to have the sinful nature until we die or are changed.

Now I have been listening to a new bible teacher who says that when he was crucified with Christ, his old nature was crucified too. ...[text shortened]... ning this new birth. We just have to understand to believe it and apply it.
What do you think?

What do I think about what, exactly?

Originally posted by Velns
What do I think about what, exactly?

Do Christians still have a sin nature?

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Do Christians still have a sin nature?

Yes. Surprised you even ask that. Did you previously believe that Christians were sinless?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Yes. Surprised you even ask that. Did you previously believe that Christians were sinless?

In the spirit part of them, yes.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
In the spirit part of them, yes.

Maybe you can point me to a passage in the bible that led you to believe that?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Maybe you can point me to a passage in the bible that led you to believe that?

Lets start with this one....
1 John 3:9
Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.
NKJV

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Lets start with this one....
1 John 3:9
Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.
NKJV

Perhaps John did not have any problem with the sin nature of the flesh. However, most of us are more like the apostle Paul who seems to have continually struggled against the sin nature of the flesh. I guess I can only speak for myself, but if what John said means that one born of God can not sin in the flesh, then I have not been born of God, because I would have no trouble sinning in the flesh if I let myself do anything I desired.

Does this bible teacher claim that he is unable to sin and does not sin? Or does he say he doesn't sin any more, that is, any more than he used to?

The Instructor

Originally posted by RJHinds
Perhaps John did not have any problem with the sin nature of the flesh. However, most of us are more like the apostle Paul who seems to have continually struggled against the sin nature of the flesh. I guess I can only speak for myself, but if what John said means that one born of God can not sin in the flesh, then I have not been born of God, because I wo ...[text shortened]... Or does he say he doesn't sin any more, that is, any more than he used to?

The Instructor

The sin nature was crucified with Christ. You now have a new nature that has the righteousness of God.
The reason you and I can still sin is because of what our minds have been taught all our lives. Our minds need to be taught what we have in Christ now. We are sanctified, redeemed, we have the righteousness of God, we have the ministry if reconciliation, we have the mind of Christ, etc.

No, this preacher says he still blows it, but less and less as he stays his mind on God.
His name is Andrew Wommack...

Originally posted by checkbaiter
I have always believed that every human is born with a sin nature. I still do.
I have always believed that even though I confessed Jesus as Lord, Christians continue to have the sinful nature until we die or are changed.

Now I have been listening to a new bible teacher who says that when he was crucified with Christ, his old nature was crucified too. ...[text shortened]... ning this new birth. We just have to understand to believe it and apply it.
What do you think?

All humans sin from their very birth until they die. The bible clearly expresses this.
Many believe that once they accept Jesus as the saviour of mankind, they are saved. The Bible does not teach this.
The Bible does explain that one has to do the best they possibly can to gain God's salvation but even then it is a difficult thing and we all have to wait to see who he and his son deside who gains this blessing of life.
This renewing you are speaking of is simply adjusting ones life in line with God's ways as much as possible and follow his commands especially this deep into the last days.
One condition that a follower of Jesus must do is to "not be part of the world". So one would have to learn by Jesus's words what such a command means and then apply it in their life.


You stated: "We have the righteousness of God, and many other awesome things concerning this new birth."

This "new birth" you are referring to does not apply to all humans but only to the select few that do actually go to heaven to be beside Jesus during his rule over the earth that his father Jehovah grants him to do for a period of time.

Originally posted by galveston75
All humans sin from their very birth until they die. The bible clearly expresses this.
Many believe that once they accept Jesus as the saviour of mankind, they are saved. The Bible does not teach this.
The Bible does explain that one has to do the best they possibly can to gain God's salvation but even then it is a difficult thing and we all have to ...[text shortened]... his rule over the earth that his father Jehovah grants him to do for a period of time.

What??? I totally disagree with this.
John 3:16 God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son that WHOSOEVER believes in him ....
There is nothing about a select few, in fact Paul was sent to the Gentiles, God wanted to save the Gentiles too. That includes you and me!

Originally posted by checkbaiter
The sin nature was crucified with Christ. You now have a new nature that has the righteousness of God.
The reason you and I can still sin is because of what our minds have been taught all our lives. Our minds need to be taught what we have in Christ now. We are sanctified, redeemed, we have the righteousness of God, we have the ministry if reconciliatio ...[text shortened]... he still blows it, but less and less as he stays his mind on God.
His name is Andrew Wommack...

I sin less and less too, however, what does that prove?

The Holy Bible says we must endure in our faith to the end, then we will be saved.

The Instructor

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Lets start with this one....
1 John 3:9
Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God.
NKJV

First you did not explain what you meant by saying that the spirit part of Christian cannot sin. I undertand that when a man sins he sins. Can he say my body sinned and my spirit did not? Is there a reference that supports that?

If you really understand that verse then can you explain what is meant by 'his seed remains in him'? I went through a few commentaries and nobody seems to be able to say what that means.

In any case if you take the verse literally then I have no problem with it. I have a problem with you using it to support the idea that Christians cannot sin in general and that all Christians are born of God.

Are you taking the expression 'born of God' to mean all those who are baptised? What exactly does 'born of God' mean. To my understanding baptism by water and baptism by the holy spirit are two separate things. Maybe 'baptism by the holy spirit' and 'born of God' are equivalent events.

Originally posted by galveston75
All humans sin from their very birth until they die. The bible clearly expresses this..

ALL ?? Curious about where the Bible clearly says this. Maybe you are confusing inherited sin from Adam with actual comitted sins.

Bear in mind the Bible described some as 'perfect'...

Job_1:8 And the LORD said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?