A Typical RHP SF discussion

@tom-wolsey said
I won't feed the trolls with anymore commentary on the subject.

You seemed to be professing some interest in South Korean culture and dismissing someone else as culturally ignorant about it.

I have now told you something you apparently did not know about an aspect of South Korean culture.

Expressing my objection to the sexualization of children ~ in light of the video clip you were keen on [as you said "those South Koreans are masters at presentation"] can hardly be described as "trolling".

@tom-wolsey said
Let the wonder twins masturbate together as they dream up more ways to silence the rest of us.

"Masturbate"?

I would rather you just went ahead and discussed the topic that's been raised - the sexualization of children in pop culture - rather than choose "silence".

@suzianne said
You want a show of principles? ...

I have principles, unlike you. And I'm NOT going to give them up to satisfy your ego or your cult of personality hegemony.

How do your feminist principles inform your stance on twentysomething Korean sex symbols dressing as school children in a pop video?

@tom-wolsey said
Japanese? No
School girls? No
Short skirts? Not as short as Western girls in music

I don't see there's anything wrong with Western women dancing ~ I will use the word "women" if it's OK by you seeing as we are not talking about children ~ as long as they are not twenty-somethings who are making a career out of being highly sexualized pop celebrities who are dressing up as highschool children [i.e. "girls"].

Unlike me, you might not have spent many years living in Japan [and some time in South Korea too... J-Pop and K-Pop are, after all, very similar in almost every way], so you might not realize that the indirect sexualization of teenage girls, by having famously sexually active adults dancing around to pop music pretending to be school pupils ~ an absolutely unmistakable trope/imagery served up in a very, very deliberate way ~ is somewhere way over there on the grotty, nasty end of "Asian culture".

If the twenty-somethings were not dressing as underage or "barely legal" school children, you would not hear a peep from me. I am not much interested in adults dancing.

How many 'billions' of people that have watched the video - that you like so much - is neither here nor there. How many conservative and devout Korean Christians like it and tell their friends to watch it - now that would be a more interesting statistic.

The Swedes knocked it on the head by the end of the 70s I think, at least in the mainstream. Benny Hill marked the end of it in the UK in the same decade and now his oeuvre is unbroadcastable.

Maybe you should travel to Japan and South Korea and that part of the world generally [Vietnam, Thailand, maybe elsewhere] and soak up some of the raw, trashy sexualized stuff that is now part of C21st culture there? [Bump]

@fmf said
I don't see there's anything wrong with Western women dancing ~ I will use the word "women" if it's OK by you seeing as we are not talking about children ~ as long as they are not twenty-somethings who are making a career out of being highly sexualized pop celebrities who are dressing up as highschool children [i.e. "girls"].

Unlike me, you might not have spent many years liv ...[text shortened]... and soak up some of the raw, trashy sexualized stuff that is now part of C21st culture there? [Bump]

Thanks for the info. Regardless of the history which I didn't know, I didn't consider any of what I saw as "sexual." I like the music and like the choreographed dancing. If there are those who can't withstand seeing a 25 year old in a skirt without dropping their pants and defiling their keyboard, that's their problem. I don't have that problem.

@tom-wolsey said
If there are those who can't withstand seeing a 25 year old in a skirt without dropping their pants and defiling their keyboard, that's their problem. I don't have that problem.

I haven't suggested anything like this. It is you who has introduced this kind of thing into the conversation.

@tom-wolsey said
Regardless of the history which I didn't know, I didn't consider any of what I saw as "sexual." I like the music and like the choreographed dancing.

They are South Korean sex symbols in their twenties. They are wearing highschool-style schoolgirl uniforms.

@tom-wolsey said
As stated when I posted the video, I had just discovered K-Pop. I was marveling at it because I'd never seen anything like it. And yeah, I think it's cute.

Would you count yourself as generally fairly ignorant about South Korean culture?

@tom-wolsey said
I was marveling at it because I'd never seen anything like it. And yeah, I think it's cute. The video I posted has somewhere around a billion views, so I guess the girl group has worldwide appeal, hmmm?

And yeah, I think it's cute.

Would it have been more "cute" or less "cute" ~ to your way of thinking ~ if they had not been dressed as highschool girls?

@fmf said
How do your feminist principles inform your stance on twentysomething Korean sex symbols dressing as school children in a pop video?

K-Pop is far, far less "sexualized" than what you see in the America. Compare K-Pop idols to... Cardi B for example. It's night and day. I find K-Pop music uplifting, the groups don't show any cleavage, and their skirts are longer. And you won't find any videos of K-pop idols telling their female audience how to perform oral sex. Can't be said of certain music celebrities in America. I will continue to search and find music generated outside America. My favorite artists over the years have been for example, Swedish, British, Pakistani, Greek, etc. Just days ago, I saw and heard K-pop for the very first time and posted a video for fun. Male groups have good music as well. My playlist now includes BTS and BIGBANG, both male groups. So far the only female group I like (at all) is Blackpink. The rest of what I've heard is not my style.

@tom-wolsey said
I didn't consider any of what I saw as "sexual."

What did the word "cute" refer to then when you used it?

@tom-wolsey said
K-Pop is far, far less "sexualized" than what you see in the America.

I have not been talking about "sexualized" pop music. I'm not interested in that. I have been talking about the sexualization of children in pop music culture.

@tom-wolsey said
So far the only female group I like (at all) is Blackpink.

How many of their pop videos have them dressed as school children?

@fmf said
And yeah, I think it's cute.

Would it have been more "cute" or less "cute" ~ to your way of thinking ~ if they had not been dressed as highschool girls?

Yes, just as cute. School girl has absolutely nothing to do with it. I draw the line at "cute." Whatever.

Good lord. This whole thing started when I stumbled into a story about a "K-pop" singer Goo Hara, who killed herself because she was cyber-bullied. Her best friend killed herself a month before. She was the top singer at the time so her suicide was a big deal. A few clicks later, I was introduced to Blackpink and, without the slightest hesitation I shared a video of theirs in a music video thread. Then DG saw an opportunity and is currently on a mission to run me out of the forums using a the "pedo" angle. Ha. Trump tactics.