- Joined
- 16 Jan 07
- Moves
- 95105
12 Jul 12
Originally posted by VoidSpiritha! yes, good point. a myth within a myth.
well, the whole thing is a myth, but where did you hear about this 12 year old business?
reading a few web pages, they all suggested between 12 and 16. the majority had her at 12-13 due to girls of the time generally being married off as soon as they started menstruating. a few sites tried to work backwards from the age jesus died subtracted from the average age of death for a woman. both methods are inaccurate. i wondered if any christians on here new better or cared.
12 Jul 12
4 edits
Originally posted by stellspalfieyeah mythical man was not really born, Biblical account of mythical man has not really
ha! yes, good point. a myth within a myth.
reading a few web pages, they all suggested between 12 and 16. the majority had her at 12-13 due to girls of the time generally being married off as soon as they started menstruating. a few sites tried to work backwards from the age jesus died subtracted from the average age of death for a woman. both methods are inaccurate. i wondered if any christians on here new better or cared.
influenced some of the most sublime achievements in art, literature and music and
inspired millions by his alleged life course, his fabricated teaching and hypothetical
example - the ship of fools.
- Joined
- 16 Jan 07
- Moves
- 95105
12 Jul 12
Originally posted by robbie carrobieive wrote a short essay a few weeks back on a virtual church called the church of fools, have you heard about it? is it connected to the ship of fools?
yeah mythical man was not really born, Biblical account of mythical man has not really
influenced some of the most sublime achievements in art, literature and music and
inspired millions by his alleged life course, his fabricated teaching and hypothetical
example - the ship of fools.
- Joined
- 29 Dec 08
- Moves
- 6788
12 Jul 12
Originally posted by robbie carrobieThat's an interesting allusion, as it reminds us of the original work, which was a parody of the church.
yeah mythical man was not really born, Biblical account of mythical man has not really
influenced some of the most sublime achievements in art, literature and music and
inspired millions by his alleged life course, his fabricated teaching and hypothetical
example - the ship of fools.
"The ship of fools is an allegory that has long been a fixture in Western literature and art. The allegory depicts a vessel populated by human inhabitants who are deranged, frivolous, or oblivious passengers aboard a ship without a pilot, and seemingly ignorant of their own direction. This concept makes up the framework of the 15th century book Ship of Fools (1494) by Sebastian Brant, which served as the inspiration for Bosch's famous painting, Ship of Fools: a ship—an entire fleet at first—sets off from Basel to the paradise of fools. In literary and artistic compositions of the 15th and 16th centuries, the cultural motif of the ship of fools also served to parody the 'ark of salvation' as the Catholic Church was styled." [emphasis added]
One could say it was directed only at the Catholic Church, but in 1494 the CC was still the only game in town.
Later analysis is similar. "Michel Foucault, who wrote Madness and Civilization, saw in the ship of fools a symbol of the consciousness of sin and evil alive in the medieval mindset and imaginative landscapes of the Renaissance. "
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_fools
12 Jul 12
5 edits
Originally posted by JS357Its also an excellent song by The Doors (of perception), no doubt inspired by the
That's an interesting allusion, as it reminds us of the original work, which was a parody of the church.
"The ship of fools is an allegory that has long been a fixture in Western literature and art. The allegory depicts a vessel populated by human inhabitants who are deranged, frivolous, or oblivious passengers aboard a ship without a pilot, and seem aginative landscapes of the Renaissance. "
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_fools
original. I must confess, i have not read the book, although I would like to. When I
was an art student I was a great admirer of Bosch. Now, art is conceptual and one can
hardly attend a degree show without wondering if the students have been picked at
random from a group of passers by, they should hand out paper bags in case of
vomiting. I am very pessimistic about the creative arts to be honest.
13 Jul 12
1 edit
Originally posted by stellspalfieAre there christians on here?
ha! yes, good point. a myth within a myth.
reading a few web pages, they all suggested between 12 and 16. the majority had her at 12-13 due to girls of the time generally being married off as soon as they started menstruating. a few sites tried to work backwards from the age jesus died subtracted from the average age of death for a woman. both methods are inaccurate. i wondered if any christians on here new better or cared.
13 Jul 12
Originally posted by stellspalfiedifferent cultures have different ages of consent but that's a pointless argument.
ha! yes, good point. a myth within a myth.
reading a few web pages, they all suggested between 12 and 16. the majority had her at 12-13 due to girls of the time generally being married off as soon as they started menstruating. a few sites tried to work backwards from the age jesus died subtracted from the average age of death for a woman. both methods are inaccurate. i wondered if any christians on here new better or cared.
consent was not even an issue when it came to women back then (and even up to now in some places), no matter what their age. they didn't have much choice and sometimes the man didn't have much of a choice either.
however, in many cases there was a distinction between marriage and consummation. two children as young as 8 could be married, but they would not consummate until years later when both reached a mature (mature enough for the culture) age.
13 Jul 12
Originally posted by VoidSpiritAren't they paired up when they are born in India?
different cultures have different ages of consent but that's a pointless argument.
consent was not even an issue when it came to women back then (and even up to now in some places), no matter what their age. they didn't have much choice and sometimes the man didn't have much of a choice either.
however, in many cases there was a distinction betwee ...[text shortened]... consummate until years later when both reached a mature (mature enough for the culture) age.
- Joined
- 16 Jan 07
- Moves
- 95105
13 Jul 12
Originally posted by robbie carrobiei dont think the art world is as bad as people think. the papers only ever report on the controversial work like emin and hirst. i studied art back in the mid to late 90's and most of the people i knew were traditional painters and sculptors. i also worked in a few galleries around london in the early 00's and there were lots of exhibitions showing good old fashioned painting skills, but the only exhibitions to make the news were the ones trying to shock. there have also been a fair few painters nominated for the turner over the last few years. if you like bosch check out paul noble who has been nominated for this years turner.
Its also an excellent song by The Doors (of perception), no doubt inspired by the
original. I must confess, i have not read the book, although I would like to. When I
was an art student I was a great admirer of Bosch. Now, art is conceptual and one can
hardly attend a degree show without wondering if the students have been picked at
random f ...[text shortened]... t paper bags in case of
vomiting. I am very pessimistic about the creative arts to be honest.
14 Jul 12
1 edit
Originally posted by stellspalfieThe turner prize is just a gimmick, advertisers get a plug and some 'artist', gets 15 minutes of fame.
i dont think the art world is as bad as people think. the papers only ever report on the controversial work like emin and hirst. i studied art back in the mid to late 90's and most of the people i knew were traditional painters and sculptors. i also worked in a few galleries around london in the early 00's and there were lots of exhibitions showing good ...[text shortened]... ew years. if you like bosch check out paul noble who has been nominated for this years turner.