I want to reconcile uncertainty and certainty when starting from a point of chaos, which is characterized by uncertainty galore. We are talking about life, and the precision in life’s operations driven by highly complex, integrated systems; these are clearly not random. Therefore, whatever we say makes these occur must be able to produce these types of systems when we discuss the most complex set of highly precise, information-driven processes.
Information is the removal of uncertainty; the greater the odds against something happening, the greater the information there. A coin flip is 50/50, while a dice roll is one of six. There is more information about the dice, because there were more ways it could have landed. Life has many ways it could unfold, given the numerous chemical reactions taking place.
Chemicals react, and if life came together through these reactions by chance, the right chemicals would happen to be in the same place at the same time, with the right quantities, in a life-friendly environment, without anything that would suppress or hinder the right reactions. Could they come together to produce life?
In life, we observe interdependent, integrated, multifaceted, holistic, and synergistic systems. Therefore, my question is, can the complexity we see in life be generated by an unguided process that came together without a mind’s intent by design? By necessity, all odds against life-friendly reactions need to be overcome, rendering those odds a non-factor; so, no matter how many ways it could go wrong, it would not, even without help.
If all we can point out is that it possibly happened this way or that, there is nothing in those types of suggestions that indicates this would happen because of that. That is more in line with wishful thinking than with factual certainty; there is nothing to imply that life is inevitable under these conditions. If, because of this, an inevitable cause is not forthcoming under those conditions, that is merely wishful thinking; nothing about that is evidence-driven, only just so stories.
Another thing, when those who suggest it could happen in a warm pond, just put a huge limit on the starting material, as when chemical reactions occur, they do not evolve, they react, and when reactions occur, they do not do so with any plan in mind. If what is required for life is present in the pond and reactions occur, it is likely that, in the end, reactions will not move toward a life-friendly direction when the un-life-friendly direction far outweighs the one required. This is so bad that even if you were to receive a life-friendly reaction to start the full process, nothing there will protect that one product going forward, so how long will that last?
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Many have trouble integrating these concepts like noise which connotes a sensory perception and describes random or pseudorandom processes. Chaos can be recognized better since it's understood on a lower dimension. I read a thing on information theory that suggests there's an overgeneralization bias with formulaic or algorithmic learning. The large database modeling loses predictive confidence sometimes as it reaches a consistent data threshold on its logistic map. Does this hint at a peak or plateau to deep machine ability or just that anomalies happen intrinsically?
In data science, integrity is of key importance and organization (completion) can be impractical due to complex information loss. Consider this article taking the example of audio-visual readings which simplifies the patterns found and fails to differentiate.
https://scisimple.com/en/articles/2025-09-18-challenges-in-learning-from-music-videos--a37vz45
@Of-Ants-and-Imps saidDon’t you concider data integrity certainty and without that gibberish?
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Many have trouble integrating these concepts like noise which connotes a sensory perception and describes random or pseudorandom processes. Chaos can be recognized better since it's understood on a lower dimension. I read a thing on information theory that suggests there's an overgeneralization bias with formulaic or algorithmic learning. The large database mode ...[text shortened]... te.
https://scisimple.com/en/articles/2025-09-18-challenges-in-learning-from-music-videos--a37vz45
@KellyJay said
I want to reconcile uncertainty and certainty when starting from a point of chaos, which is characterized by uncertainty galore. We are talking about life, and the precision in life’s operations driven by highly complex, integrated systems; these are clearly not random. Therefore, whatever we say makes these occur must be able to produce these types of systems when we disc ...[text shortened]... full process, nothing there will protect that one product going forward, so how long will that last?
I have posted links from both of these guys before. It was nice hearing them talk together about chemistry, abiogenesis, and evolution. Heavy chemistry avoid if that is not for you.
@KellyJay
Gibbery nuggets of precise information, or characterized by signal breadth? A better example for certainty are the bitcoin or cryptocurrency hashes used to ensure data integrity. Cooking with more pressure there. Conceivably, life could have begun as the microbial payload securely buried in planet, awaiting the switch of spirit. It's not all so uncouth.
@Of-Ants-and-Imps saidHowever you arrange things, the arrangement, not the environment, is the key to information. You can have any medium to display information, from smoke signals, Morse code, ink, and paper. The medium and environment don’t make it easier; only the mind makes such things possible to do and recognize.
@KellyJay
Gibbery nuggets of precise information, or characterized by signal breadth? A better example for certainty are the bitcoin or cryptocurrency hashes used to ensure data integrity. Cooking with more pressure there. Conceivably, life could have begun as the microbial payload securely buried in planet, awaiting the switch of spirit. It's not all so uncouth.