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Originally posted by twhitehead"it is not possible to take ones own life"
I'm as lost as you. What did you mean?
"so when you get yourself on fire, it's god who's killing you?"
both pretty ridiculous statements if you ask me... which you didn't but you're going to listen anyway... obviously we are all in control of our own actions, if you take robbies quote literally you have give an argument to the fundamentalists who claim to be doing the work of god.
Originally posted by trev33what i meant, is that it is not morally permissible for a Christian to take his own life, sorry for the confusion and inaccuracy, i hope it clears matters up.
"it is not possible to take ones own life"
"so when you get yourself on fire, it's god who's killing you?"
both pretty ridiculous statements if you ask me... which you didn't but you're going to listen anyway... obviously we are all in control of our own actions, if you take robbies quote literally you have give an argument to the funda[b]mentalists who claim to be doing the work of god.[/b]
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI beleive there was one case where a monastary was about to be overtaken and the captives no doubt tortured. So a monk sat out front of the oncoming soldiers and set himself alight.
what i meant, is that it is not morally permissible for a Christian to take his own life, sorry for the confusion and inaccuracy, i hope it clears matters up.
I talked to a vet onced and he told me that seeing a bhuddist set themselves alight was the most profound,life-changing thing ever. Made him into a pacifist
Originally posted by karoly aczelNovember 7th, 1866, Arkadi, Creta.
I beleive there was one case where a monastary was about to be overtaken and the captives no doubt tortured. So a monk sat out front of the oncoming soldiers and set himself alight.
I talked to a vet onced and he told me that seeing a bhuddist set themselves alight was the most profound,life-changing thing ever. Made him into a pacifist
Τhe Turkish army has the Arcadi monastery encircled with vastly superior forces and under fierce attack, and when the gate of the monastery collapsed due to heavy bombardment straight on it they entered Arkadi. The superior monk of the monastery, Gabriel, orders the children, the women and the fighter Kostantis Giamboudakis to follow him down to the ammunition storage of the monastery whilst the last Cretans are fighting the invaders. When the Turkish soldiers killed the Cretan fighters and they were ready to enter the ammunition storage apartment, Giamboudakis shoot a barrel of ammunition and the monastery exploded killing all the Greeks and the Turkish intruders.
After this incident the allies of Greece supported the fight of the Cretans until 1998, the year the isle of Creta became a part of Greece;
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Originally posted by black beetleIncredible story you guys, liberation theology me thinks. As to the moral implications, i can speak for no one but myself as i see it, had i been there, i dunno, someone would have killed me, but it wouldn't have been at my own hand.
November 7th, 1866, Arkadi, Creta.
Τhe Turkish army has the Arcadi monastery encircled with vastly superior forces and under fierce attack, and when the gate of the monastery collapsed due to heavy bombardment straight on it they entered Arkadi. The superior monk of the monastery, Gabriel, orders the children, the women and the fighter Kostantis G ...[text shortened]... pported the fight of the Cretans until 1998, the year the isle of Creta became a part of Greece;
Given half a chance id take back Constantinople, where i am reliably informed there was a Scotsman defending that city, a mining engineer who was able to locate the digging of Turkish tunnels to undermine the great city.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieSo ye know that incident ye lang leggedy beastie!
Incredible story you guys, liberation theology me thinks. As to the moral implications, i can speak for no one but myself as i see it, had i been there, i dunno, someone would have killed me, but it wouldn't have been at my own hand.
Given half a chance id take back Constantinople, where i am reliably informed there was a Scotsman defending that c ...[text shortened]... ing engineer who was able to locate the digging of Turkish tunnels to undermine the great city.
The Grand Duke Lucas Notaras, the defender of the sea walls of Constantinople in collaboration with the Venetian fleet, found the famous engineer John Grant (Grant was mentioned falsely as a German by some Byzantine historians but he was either an Englishman or a Scot, and his name indicates that he was probably Scottish) and asked him to undertake the countermining operations of that segment of the wall. Grant blew up the Serbs’ tunnel along with all the enemy personnel, and the next days along with Notaras’ men he destroyed the Serbs’ mines by means of either flooding them, or burning them out or blowing them up and then filing them with smoke in order to drive out the enemy soldiers and technicians.
On May 23 Notaras’ and Grant’s miners captured many sappers who were trying to drive a mine into the Blachernae sector. After severe and repeated torture an Ottoman official prisoner revealed all the places where the Serbs and the Turkish miners were working beneath the walls, and then the Byzantines eliminated easily those threats.
After 6 days Constantinople was invaded. Nobody knows what happened to John Grant.
Originally posted by black beetleOh I wrote down a false date: obviously Creta was liberated and became again a part of the Greek soil in 1898 -I am sorry for the inconvenience.
November 7th, 1866, Arkadi, Creta.
Τhe Turkish army has the Arcadi monastery encircled with vastly superior forces and under fierce attack, and when the gate of the monastery collapsed due to heavy bombardment straight on it they entered Arkadi. The superior monk of the monastery, Gabriel, orders the children, the women and the fighter Kostantis G ...[text shortened]... pported the fight of the Cretans until 1998, the year the isle of Creta became a part of Greece;
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Originally posted by black beetleyes this is the very same beetle, i read recently in an excellent account of the whole affair, apparently there are even still some links from the great chain that stretched across the Bosphorus lying around the city as recently as the nineteen thirties!
So ye know that incident ye lang leggedy beastie!
The Grand Duke Lucas Notaras, the defender of the sea walls of Constantinople in collaboration with the Venetian fleet, found the famous engineer John Grant (Grant was mentioned falsely as a German by some Byzantine historians but he was either an Englishman or a Scot, and his name indicates that he w ...[text shortened]... se threats.
After 6 days Constantinople was invaded. Nobody knows what happened to John Grant.1
Alas the city was betrayed by the jealousies of Christendom, too fabled, too rich and majestically adorned, i weeped for those young Christian women who were forcibly taken to the harem of the Turk, the spoils of war and what is more i loathed those who willingly embraced Islam after the fall of the great city! Yet in the midst of it i glowed with vain national pride that a single Scotsman had stood with his Greek friends defiant of the oppressor!
who shall stand with us? Constantinople and onwards!
Originally posted by robbie carrobieJohannes Grandus de Arcaleus -John Grant of Ardcalloch- fought against all odds a war that was not his business; back then the City was defended by 6.000 Byzantines and almost 2.000 European mercenaries. Mehmeds’ forces remain unclear but they are estimated nearly up to 200.000 soldiers. No chance for the defenders to survive; to me, the Scot is a hero.
yes this is the very same beetle, i read recently in an excellent account of the whole affair, apparently there are even still some links from the great chain that stretched across the Bosphorus lying around the city as recently as the nineteen thirties!
Alas the city was betrayed by the jealousies of Christendom, too fabled, too rich and majestic ...[text shortened]... Greek friends defiant of the oppressor!
who shall stand with us? Constantinople and onwards!
I hijacked the thread, but I couldn’t stand talking about living mummies who turned into dead mummies for nothing
😵
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Originally posted by black beetlewow, this place ardcalloch is not far from me beetle, there used to be a Viking longboat found on the river Clyde that got obliterated by a bomb in WWII. Yes an excellent character although i think he would rather die with his Greek friends than suffer torture or enslavement under the Turks. The impression i got was that it was them Turkish cannons that really did it for the great city, like pieces guard entry to a penetration point on the seventh rank of a chess board, they guarded the Bosphorus from any attempt at relief, while pounding the great city.
Johannes Grandus de Arcaleus -John Grant of Ardcalloch- fought against all odds a war that was not his business; back then the City was defended by 6.000 Byzantines and almost 2.000 European mercenaries. Mehmeds’ forces remain unclear but they are estimated nearly up to 200.000 soldiers. No chance for the defenders to survive; to me, the Scot is a hero. ...[text shortened]... , but I couldn’t stand talking about living mummies who turned into dead mummies for nothing
😵
Originally posted by robbie carrobieThis is the case🙂
wow, this place ardcalloch is not far from me beetle, there used to be a Viking longboat found on the river Clyde that got obliterated by a bomb in WWII. Yes an excellent character although i think he would rather die with his Greek friends than suffer torture or enslavement under the Turks. The impression i got was that it was them Turkish cannon ...[text shortened]... ess board, they guarded the Bosphorus from any attempt at relief, while pounding the great city.