Busting the blank slate

Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
We just convert it all into golf estates.

And football stadiums.

But the important issue is, if josephw hates concrete so much, why is he putting it everywhere? If he doesn't hate it, then whats his point?
Josephw talks as if it is self evident that what man does is 'wrong' yet the fact that man does it, means that a significant number of people don't find it self evident or they wouldn't be doing it. There must be a number of people who prefer golf estates to either concrete or African bush - they clearly don't think it is self evident that creating golf estates is wrong.

Originally posted by josephw
Okay, let's go there.

I'm not a neuropsychologist or anything like it. But I've read about this stuff for decades. It's all very interesting. Mapping out the brain. Finding out how it works. It's all well and good, but the implications are man made.
The scientist insists that we are merely animals without soul or spirit, and simply respond to our enviro ...[text shortened]... environment. The brain plays a role in our thinking, but it's not what generates thought.

It's a nice idea, but how does that work in the case of brain damage? Also, the "ghost in the machine" speculation also runs into reductio ad absurdum arguments (if the ghost makes us work, what makes the ghost work?) and issues with the mind-body problem (pineal gland anyone?).

I have another fascinating book recommendation on the nature of consciousness you may be interested in - "I Am A Strange Loop" by Douglas Hofstadter. It gives a very plausible explanation for the emergence of consciousness from unconscious matter, which avoids the problems the "ghost in the machine" runs into.

Originally posted by josephw
The part about God being ugly was stupid.

Maybe you live in a city. If you ever get to spend much time in the country on a farm you'll learn the difference between nature and man.

It's not the same as what's on TV.

Nature has natural rhythms and doesn't deviate to far from it. Man on the other hand runs rampant destroying everything in sight.

You have to admit that not all natural landscapes are beautiful, and that not all cityscapes are ugly. There's an interesting evolutionary argument for why people think this way, with the most pleasant spaces combining aspects of freedom of movement and sight lines, abundance of resources and adequate shelter or high ground - just the sort of space a prehistoric human tribe would thrive in.

Originally posted by Palynka
Can you explain why the "noble savage" myth plays a big part in religion? I see it as almost the opposite for many (proselytizing) religions.

You make a good point. When I wrote that, I was thinking about the New Testament idea of ""I tell you the truth, anyone who will not receive the kingdom of God like a little child will never enter it." (Mark 10:15...I not so good with bible references so I looked this one up on Wikipedia 😳), sounding to me like a return to innocence from which we came. However, the taint of original sin would suggest that people are born bad and have to redeem ourselves in the eyes of God, which sounds like the opposite of the "noble savage" myth.

(I also assume that's why most Catholic meals consist of red meat and guilt! 😵)

Ah, those "noble" pre-historic "savages"...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/8394802.stm

Originally posted by twhitehead
And football stadiums.

But the important issue is, if josephw hates concrete so much, why is he putting it everywhere? If he doesn't hate it, then whats his point?
Josephw talks as if it is self evident that what man does is 'wrong' yet the fact that man does it, means that a significant number of people don't find it self evident or they wouldn't be ...[text shortened]... an bush - they clearly don't think it is self evident that creating golf estates is wrong.

Have you seen the sprawling slums of Mexico City?

When I speak of man "covering with concrete and killing everything in sight" I'm referring symbolically to man's general approach to how he lives on earth. Any perceived improvement in man's condition is relative.

The way I see it, from the earliest historical accounts to the present, history shows a continuous wave of death and destruction.

Now before you go and think I'm a pessimist, think again. Nothing could be further from the truth. I am a realist. While there is much good to speak of, the reality of the human condition dominates the field.

Concerning what I hate, there's nothing I hate more than a lie. I don't hate concrete. That would be stupid. I don't hate people. That would be wrong. I do hate injustice. Who doesn't?

Originally posted by PBE6
You have to admit that not all natural landscapes are beautiful, and that not all cityscapes are ugly. There's an interesting evolutionary argument for why people think this way, with the most pleasant spaces combining aspects of freedom of movement and sight lines, abundance of resources and adequate shelter or high ground - just the sort of space a prehistoric human tribe would thrive in.

I think the reason we say a landscape is ugly is because it is uninhabitable.
I think cities are ugly because they are uninhabitable. At least by me. The noise and pollution is ugly. Too many people crammed into too small an area makes a city. There's no freedom in a city.

Just my personal opinion.

Originally posted by josephw
I think the reason we say a landscape is ugly is because it is uninhabitable.
I think cities are ugly because they are uninhabitable. At least by me. The noise and pollution is ugly. Too many people crammed into too small an area makes a city. There's no freedom in a city.

Just my personal opinion.

Just read the book, would ya?