1. Joined
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    13 Dec '07 05:231 edit
    Here is a statement made by a man named Maimonides.

    "Man's love of God is identical with his knowledge of him"

    Who here disagrees? Whether we believe God to be a myth or a reality we all have an mental image of what God is and we embrace this image or reject this image.
  2. Joined
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    13 Dec '07 05:25
    Originally posted by whodey
    Here is a statement made by a man named Maimonides.

    "Man's love of God is identical with his knowledge of him"

    Who here disagrees?
    I completely agree.
  3. Cape Town
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    13 Dec '07 06:121 edit
    Originally posted by whodey
    Here is a statement made by a man named Maimonides.

    "Man's love of God is identical with his knowledge of him"

    Who here disagrees? Whether we believe God to be a myth or a reality we all have an mental image of what God is and we embrace this image or reject this image.
    I must be misunderstanding what you are saying, because I have many possible images of God, some of which I like, some of which I don't like, none of which I love, and none of which I believe in.

    I do agree that many Christians I have talked to believe in a God because they like the image they have created and will quite readily admit it (knightmeister for example has repeatedly pointed out the utility of his image of God and said that if it is not useful to him then he will discard it).
  4. Standard memberSwissGambit
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    13 Dec '07 07:45
    Originally posted by whodey
    "Man's love of God is inversely proportional to his knowledge of him."
    Fixed.
  5. Joined
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    13 Dec '07 07:47
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    I must be misunderstanding what you are saying, because I have many possible images of God, some of which I like, some of which I don't like, none of which I love, and none of which I believe in.

    I do agree that many Christians I have talked to believe in a God because they like the image they have created and will quite readily admit it (knightmeister ...[text shortened]... utility of his image of God and said that if it is not useful to him then he will discard it).
    You are right, there are many possible images of God. However, is there none that you love? For example, a God who gives you everything you love and the very ability to love, would you love this God?

    Of coarse none would serve a God they did not love. Why would they? I suppose that one could make the arguement that they serve out of fear.
  6. Standard memberknightmeister
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    13 Dec '07 13:17
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    I must be misunderstanding what you are saying, because I have many possible images of God, some of which I like, some of which I don't like, none of which I love, and none of which I believe in.

    I do agree that many Christians I have talked to believe in a God because they like the image they have created and will quite readily admit it (knightmeister ...[text shortened]... utility of his image of God and said that if it is not useful to him then he will discard it).
    Whoah there whitey! The reason why I would discard something that is not useful in anyway as being the truth is because I believe truth has to be lived and has to be functional. A God who exists is functional. Truth means nothing if it doesn't have the power to transform us or change things , it's dead truth. It's like saying that your washing machine is made of chocolate . The uselessness of it makes you wonder if it can really be a washing machine. A real washing machine would work.


    If you want to portray others faith as being a matter of whim or fancy because that is comforting to you then just own it for yourself instead of projecting it onto others.
  7. Cape Town
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    13 Dec '07 13:25
    Originally posted by knightmeister
    Whoah there whitey! The reason why I would discard something that is not useful in anyway as being the truth is because I believe truth has to be lived and has to be functional. A God who exists is functional. Truth means nothing if it doesn't have the power to transform us or change things , it's dead truth. It's like saying that your washing machine ...[text shortened]... it makes you wonder if it can really be a washing machine. A real washing machine would work.
    You clearly have a rather warped concept of what truth is. Essentially you seem to be claiming that if something is not functional for you then it isn't true and doesn't exist. That can easily be proved wrong and you know it.
  8. Cape Town
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    13 Dec '07 13:291 edit
    Originally posted by whodey
    You are right, there are many possible images of God. However, is there none that you love? For example, a God who gives you everything you love and the very ability to love, would you love this God?

    Of coarse none would serve a God they did not love. Why would they? I suppose that one could make the arguement that they serve out of fear.
    I don't really see how one can love an image of God. I guess it would be like loving your favorite painting? I would say I like some of the images but then some of the images of the devil are rather pleasing too (happy guy with forked tail and horns).

    A very significant proportion of theists do not serve God because they love him (or his image). In fact, when it really comes down to it, almost all Christians I know will admit that they serve God because they are selfish and want to get themselves into heaven. Can you honestly say that that is nor your own key motive?

    My favorite question for Christians is:
    If God came to you and offered to let someone else into heaven in your place, would you be loving enough to agree.
  9. Standard memberknightmeister
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    13 Dec '07 13:43
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    You clearly have a rather warped concept of what truth is. Essentially you seem to be claiming that if something is not functional for you then it isn't true and doesn't exist. That can easily be proved wrong and you know it.
    I didn't say that something doesn't exist if it is not functional. Clearly , there may well be some idiot in Los Angeles who has a chocolate washing machine but I'm not going to be that interested in it.

    If one's ideas about God make no difference at all in your life or have a destructive influence , what's the point? You tell me.
  10. Standard memberknightmeister
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    13 Dec '07 13:48
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    I don't really see how one can love an image of God. I guess it would be like loving your favorite painting? I would say I like some of the images but then some of the images of the devil are rather pleasing too (happy guy with forked tail and horns).

    A very significant proportion of theists do not serve God because they love him (or his image). In fac ...[text shortened]... and offered to let someone else into heaven in your place, would you be loving enough to agree.
    My favorite question for Christians is:
    If God came to you and offered to let someone else into heaven in your place, would you be loving enough to agree.----whitey--

    The problem with this question is that if you were self sacrificing enough to engage in such an act of self denying love then you would be incredibly christ like. One would only be able to do such a thing if one had surrendered utterly to the Holy Spirit . But if one had done this one would end up in heaven anyway.

    Also , we are commanded to love others AS ourselves not at the expense of ourselves .
  11. Cape Town
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    13 Dec '07 14:19
    Originally posted by knightmeister
    If one's ideas about God make no difference at all in your life or have a destructive influence , what's the point? You tell me.
    The point is that it has no bearing whatsoever on the validity of the ideas or the actual existence of said God. You however claim that genesis is not factual because it has no bearing on your life whereas the new testament is factual because it does. How egoistic of you to think that your desires can affect the existence of Jesus 2000 years ago!
  12. Cape Town
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    13 Dec '07 14:23
    Originally posted by knightmeister
    The problem with this question is that if you were self sacrificing enough to engage in such an act of self denying love then you would be incredibly christ like. One would only be able to do such a thing if one had surrendered utterly to the Holy Spirit . But if one had done this one would end up in heaven anyway.
    You are clearly trying to get out of the question. The question clearly points out that you already have a place in heaven and God is suggesting you give it up. I have noticed that almost all Christians do the same as you - avoid the question - I suppose it is too touchy a subject.

    Also, we are commanded to love others AS ourselves not at the expense of ourselves.
    So essentially if your love may lead to harm to yourself you are not required to go ahead with it? Does the same apply to loving God? If it is painful to do what God says (harm to self) then do you not need to do it?
  13. Subscribermdhall
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    13 Dec '07 14:36
    the fundamental problem with theists is that you all talk like you know god.
    In actuality, what you know are stories you read or heard from another human. That is distinctly [u]not[/u] god.

    Most philosophers and theologists agree there is not enough evidence to deny some kind of god(s) existence. So, an atheistic perspective is logically as faith based as any specific-god perspective.

    Then we have religions that are generally who are both ignorant and arrogant enough to fill in all the blanks after that about god's "personality".
    Christianity is no different in this field.

    So, a thread about how much we all know god individually...
    Just a statement of how much you've believe in what you've been told without thinking and educating yourself.

    Let's have a discussion about our personal spiritual experiences without trying to pretend we know/comprehend the what/why/how's of those experiences, and just talk about what it meant to us as real human beings.
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    13 Dec '07 15:28
    Originally posted by mdhall

    Most philosophers and theologists agree there is not enough evidence to deny some kind of god(s) existence.
    I don't think this is true. I think most philosophers consider the notion of god to be pretty deniable.
  15. SubscriberAThousandYoung
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    13 Dec '07 15:37
    Originally posted by whodey
    Here is a statement made by a man named Maimonides.

    "Man's love of God is identical with his knowledge of him"

    Who here disagrees? Whether we believe God to be a myth or a reality we all have an mental image of what God is and we embrace this image or reject this image.
    I disagree. One could just as well say that man's love of Mars is identical with knowledge about him, or talk about leprechauns, or benevolent aliens...

    Love is not equivalent to knowledge.
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