Evidence of a Creator

Originally posted by dj2becker
Maybe if you read one of my previous posts you will see that my definition of God is not "nothing". Nothing can be created that is eternal. Which basically means you believe that in the beginning was a hole, whereas I believe in the beginning was God. Your "hole" requires a lot more faith, by the way...

you can believe in whatever you want.
and now you seem to be saying god created nothing. That sounds more like an atheist's point, I'm surprised you are making it!
the hole is what contains things that exist. if there was no hole there be nowhere for god to have ever existed in.

so the hole came first

Originally posted by AThousandYoung
I think it would be a matter of faith if anyone were to take a definite position about whether everything was created or whether some things were not created. I don't take either position. I acknowledge that I don't know.

[b]do you believe that it is more likely for "nothing" to produce everything we see today?

I don't really understa ...[text shortened]... existed or not, or how it got into the low entropy state it was in at the time of the Big Bang.[/b]

I think it would be a matter of faith if anyone were to take a definite position about whether everything was created or whether some things were not created. I don't take either position. I acknowledge that I don't know.

But you are taking the definite position that God does not exist? You still require faith to say that you don't know. You cannot believe something if you don't have faith in it.


I don't really understand the question. I have no idea where matter and energy came from, whether it's always existed or not, or how it got into the low entropy state it was in at the time of the Big Bang.

So you believe in the big bang? I thought you said that you didn't know?

Originally posted by frogstomp
you can believe in whatever you want.
and now you seem to be saying god created nothing. That sounds more like an atheist's point, I'm surprised you are making it!
the hole is what contains things that exist. if there was no hole there be nowhere for god to have ever existed in.

so the hole came first

you can believe in whatever you want.
and now you seem to be saying god created nothing. That sounds more like an atheist's point, I'm surprised you are making it!

No. You are putting words in my mouth. I origionaly said that nothing that we see can exist without being created.

the hole is what contains things that exist. if there was no hole there be nowhere for god to have ever existed in.
so the hole came first

So you mean to say the hole created everything? God does not need to exist in a hole. So you believe in the invisible hole? But God who is also invisible you do not wish to believe in?

Let me get this straight? You believe that an empty hole created everything that we see today?

Originally posted by dj2becker
The definition of "anything" is not "something everlasting". The definition of God is "an everlasting being", which means he has no beginning and no end.

You are on crack. 'Anything' refers to anything at all, to any extant object or entity. If you claim that God wasn't created because he is 'everlasting', then I can claim that the universe wasn't created because it is 'everlasting'. This is not a difficult argument to grasp, and it has been pointed out here again and again.

Originally posted by dj2becker
[b]I think it would be a matter of faith if anyone were to take a definite position about whether everything was created or whether some things were not created. I don't take either position. I acknowledge that I don't know.

But you are taking the definite position that God does not exist? You still require faith to say that you don't know. You ...[text shortened]... the Big Bang.[/b]

So you believe in the big bang? I thought you said that you didn't know? [/b]

But you are taking the definite position that God does not exist?

No. As I have no significant evidence for the existence of any gods, I assume they don't exist. This is not a definite position.

You still require faith to say that you don't know.

Why?

So you believe in the big bang? I thought you said that you didn't know?

I said I don't know whether everything had been created or not. I think the evidence I've seen (which is limited, as I haven't looked too heavily into the issue) suggests the Big Bang did occur.

Originally posted by bbarr
You are on crack. 'Anything' refers to anything at all, to any extant object or entity. If you claim that God wasn't created because he is 'everlasting', then I can claim that the universe wasn't created because it is 'everlasting'. This is not a difficult argument to grasp, and it has been pointed out here again and again.

Except we sort of kind of maybe have evidence pointing towards the fact that the universe ISN'T everlasting.

But hey, if the 'freethinker' wants to restrict his thinking, more power to him.

Originally posted by Darfius
Except we sort of kind of maybe have evidence pointing towards the fact that the universe ISN'T everlasting.

But hey, if the 'freethinker' wants to restrict his thinking, more power to him.

We also have evidence that it is. Depends which evidence appeals to you really,