08 Mar 07
Originally posted by DoctorScribblesIn the Church’s latest statement on this matter, Pope John Paul II, using his full authority as the successor of Peter, states categorically that the Church cannot — not will not, but cannot — ordain women, now or in the future. The Catechism of the Catholic Church sets it out clearly, quoting the decree Inter insigniores:
Why aren't there more of them? It sure seems like there aren't that many.
Only a baptized man (vir) receives sacred ordination. The Lord Jesus chose men (viri) to form the college of the twelve apostles, and the apostles did the same when they chose collaborators to succeed them in their ministry. The college of bishops, with whom the priests are united in the priesthood, makes the college of the twelve an ever-present and ever-active reality until Christ’s return. The Church recognizes herself to be bound by this choice made by the Lord Himself. For this reason the ordination of women is not possible.
http://www.catholiceducation.org/articles/apologetics/ap0001.html
Tradition, baby! Bigots and religious numbskulls can get away with just about anything by leaning on tradition.
08 Mar 07
1 edit
Originally posted by TheSkipperJesus will straighten this mess up when he returns at the end of this cycle of the Mayan calendar.
In the Church’s latest statement on this matter, Pope John Paul II, using his full authority as the successor of Peter, states categorically that the Church cannot — not will not, but cannot — ordain women, now or in the future. The Catechism of the Catholic Church sets it out clearly, quoting the decree Inter insigniores:
Only a baptized man (vir) re ...[text shortened]... Bigots and religious numbskulls can get away with just about anything by leaning on tradition.
08 Mar 07
5 edits
Originally posted by TheSkipperRidiculous. "For this reason" -- what reason? That Jesus chose men, and those men continued to choose men?
In the Church’s latest statement on this matter, Pope John Paul II, using his full authority as the successor of Peter, states categorically that the Church cannot — not will not, but cannot — ordain women, now or in the future. The Catechism of the Catholic Church sets it out clearly, quoting the decree Inter insigniores:
Only a baptized man (vir) re ...[text shortened]... Bigots and religious numbskulls can get away with just about anything by leaning on tradition.
How many white men did Jesus choose? How many white men are priests today?
How many Chinese people did Jesus choose? How many Chinese are priests today?
How many speakers of German did Jesus choose? How many speakers of German are priests today?
How many people named Robert did Jesus choose? How many people named Robert are priests today?
How many child molesters did Jesus choose?
If there are now whites, Chinese, Germans, Roberts, and child molesters in the priesthoood, none of which were part of the original makeup, why not women? The cited argument obviously can't be the real reason, for under it, there could be none of the sorts of priests mentioned above.
What happens if an ordained priest gets a sex change?
08 Mar 07
Originally posted by no1marauderHypothetically, if Jesus were alive today and had 12 disciples (perhaps they would be called executives today) with the same evangelical agenda, would they all still be men? I highly doubt it.
Jesus will straighten this mess up when he returns at the end of this cycle of the Mayan calendar.
08 Mar 07
Originally posted by darvlayEach woman would only get around 70% of the bread given to men at Last Supper events, though, and they'd sue Jesus for sexual harassment every time he wanted a hairy pedicure.
Hypothetically, if Jesus were alive today and had 12 disciples (perhaps they would be called executives today) with the same evangelical agenda, would they all still be men? I highly doubt it.
08 Mar 07
Originally posted by TheSkipperIf this can't be changed, surely we are mistaken about the Earth revolving around the sun and not being fixed in place as well?
In the Church’s latest statement on this matter, Pope John Paul II, using his full authority as the successor of Peter, states categorically that the Church cannot — not will not, but cannot — ordain women, now or in the future. The Catechism of the Catholic Church sets it out clearly, quoting the decree Inter insigniores:
Only a baptized man (vir) re ...[text shortened]... Bigots and religious numbskulls can get away with just about anything by leaning on tradition.
08 Mar 07
1 edit
Originally posted by TheSkipperBy “full authority,” I suppose that means ex cathedra?
In the Church’s latest statement on this matter, Pope John Paul II, using his full authority as the successor of Peter, states categorically that the Church cannot — not will not, but cannot — ordain women, now or in the future.
Well, there it is then. A Catholic who is committed to the belief in Papal infallibility, needs no further argument. It seems like a pretty closed system, with more and more articles of belief to which one must commit—beyond, say the Nicene Creed and the Definition of Chalcedon—accruing across the centuries. Part of my debate with LH over Papal infallibility touched on how open one thinks a religious system can be, his view being that Orthodoxy is far too open a system.
But I’m not Catholic, and I had my brief say on the other thread.
EDIT: Some people have greater tolerance for more closed systems, some have greater tolerance for more open systems. And, if they are intellectually honest, they believe that their chosen system in some way (not necessarily in all ways) represents an appropriate expression of what is true...
08 Mar 07
Originally posted by DoctorScribblesAnd it follows that if you ordain a woman as a priest, what prevents you from ordaining a dog as a priest?
Ridiculous. "For this reason" -- what reason? That Jesus chose men, and those men continued to choose men?
How many white men did Jesus choose? How many white men are priests today?
How many Chinese people did Jesus choose? How many Chinese are priests today?
How many speakers of German did Jesus choose? How many speakers of German are ...[text shortened]... sorts of priests mentioned above.
What happens if an ordained priest gets a sex change?