07 Feb 22
@medullah said"Revealed religions" purport to be based on divinely inspired texts. The supposed divine inspiration is believed to be a revelation from the deity in question. The Torah, the Koran, the Bible are examples.
Could you define what you mean be "revealed scriptures" please?
It's not something I conscientiously know anything about.
07 Feb 22
@neilarini saidIt's not what goes into your mouth that saves or damns you, but what comes out of it.
@Kevin-Eleven
h) I saw Jesus' face on a cheese and onion crisp and saw it as a sign that I should open my heart, as well as my mouth, to jesus.
Wherefore, speak kindly to those you meet of those you met.
07 Feb 22
@kevin-eleven saidI don't believe in revealed scriptures because . . .
I believe in revealed scriptures because . . .
a) I was indoctrinated at an early age
b) I don't but my neighbors will shun me if I say so
c) I don't but my neighbors will kill me if I say so
d) God told me to
e) I enjoy exploring voluntary delusions
f) Other (please describe below)
a) I was taught at an early age not to take things on authority
b) My neighbors/friends/colleagues might shun me if I say I believe
c) The evidence does not support the claims in Scripture
d) People whose opinions I respect also don't believe
e) I enjoy exploring voluntary delusions
f) Other (please describe below)
(tick all that apply)
07 Feb 22
@fmf saidYou're putting the cart before the horse. Religions are not based on texts. Epiphanies came first, in the form of prophets, visions, avatars, incarnation, angels speaking to Abraham and Mohammed, etc.; the OT, the NT, the Koran, were written down later. They codify, and do not constitute, a revealed religion.
"Revealed religions" purport to be based on divinely inspired texts. The supposed divine inspiration is believed to be a revelation from the deity in question. The Torah, the Koran, the Bible are examples.
07 Feb 22
@moonbus saidThat accounts for a few dozen people or whatever it is, a few hundred or a thousand, or a few thousand, who knows. Then, how have these religions and their deities been "revealed" to billions and billions and billions of people over the intervening thousands of years?
Epiphanies came first, in the form of prophets, visions, avatars, incarnation, angels speaking to Abraham and Mohammed
@fmf saidPrincipally by the practitioners themselves. Nothing in the Synoptic Gospels suggests that Jesus thought his teachings would be carried on in written form. His disciples were to spread the teachings by founding 'churches', communities of people gathered in his name lead by a man who had himself received verbal instruction from one of the Apostles.
That accounts for a few dozen people or whatever it is, a few hundred or a thousand, or a few thousand, who knows. Then, how have these religions and their deities been "revealed" to billions and billions and billions of people over the intervening thousands of years?
Illiteracy was the dominant condition until very recently for most of the world's populations. Outside of Greece and Rome, very very few people, apart from the clergy, would have been able to read Hebrew or Greek or Latin during the middle ages in Europe. The NT was not written for lay persons (not until Luther translated it into vernacular German). The NT was written by and for the clergy, to stabilize a teaching which was going adrift in the 3-4 centuries which had passed since the time of the Apostles.
In the case of the Koran, it was transcribed after the Prophet's death by remembrancers who had preserved various verses (prophecies) in memory. Even today, there are illiterate Muslims who have committed the entire Koran to memory, from having heard it recited to them. That was how it was propagated in ancient times, too.
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08 Feb 22
@medullah saidHey, Pete
Hi Kev
Could you define what you mean be "revealed scriptures" please?
It's not something I conscientiously know anything about.
Sorry for the delayed reply. I think that instead of defining that phrase I'll admit that my choice of words might have been inaccurate for what I had in mind at the time; however, I will let the ensuing discussion serve as a better explication than I would dare or could hope to provide.
K
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12 Feb 22
@josephw saidDoes it make you feel better to go around calling other people cowards?
g) you're a coward for not saying what you really believe.
What I believe doesn't matter. Things are as they are no matter what a microsqueak of planet Earth believes.
But since you seem to be inquiring -- albeit in a rude and perhaps secretly defensive way:
I believe some kind of Cosmic Intelligence/Cosmic Mind is more likely than not.
However, I am agnostic about the details re: if/how/whether/when that Intelligence or Mind intervenes in human affairs, or whether It has a personality.
If It does have a personality, we should keep in mind that It would have to relate to all sentient beings throughout the Cosmos in all their variety.
A provisional and simplistic analogy could be that of someone who sets up a magic crystal tank, then patiently watches the growth of the crystals and enjoys watching their development.
But I'm not really in a position to know, am I?