1. Subscribersonhouse
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    23 Jun '13 13:07
    He says religion is not ALL bad, I say, just most of it:

    http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/06/22/church-without-god-by-design/?hpt=hp_c4
  2. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    23 Jun '13 13:231 edit
    Originally posted by sonhouse
    He says religion is not ALL bad, I say, just most of it:

    http://religion.blogs.cnn.com/2013/06/22/church-without-god-by-design/?hpt=hp_c4
    All is bad. All religion is counterfeit and made by men. All seek to obtain God's favor by an individual's good deeds and selfless works. Christianity is a relationship' in which God does the work [past tense implied, 'has done the work'] and offers His favor tangibly in the gracious free gift of eternal life and relationship with Him forever in heaven. It's nonmeritorious.
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    23 Jun '13 17:23
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    All is bad. All religion is counterfeit and made by men. All seek to obtain God's favor by an individual's good deeds and selfless works. Christianity is a relationship' in which God does the work [past tense implied, 'has done the work'] and offers His favor tangibly in the gracious free gift of eternal life and relationship with Him forever in heaven. It's nonmeritorious.
    Some of the things that happen in a religion are no better or worse than they would be if they happened outside that religion. Some things are quite admirable. I am thinking of things like a community coming together to help people whose houses were damaged in a tornado, which has happened via local churches in Moore, Oklahoma.
  4. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    23 Jun '13 17:54
    Originally posted by JS357
    [1]Some of the things that happen in a religion are no better or worse than they would be if they happened outside that religion. [2] Some things are quite admirable. I am thinking of things like a community coming together to help people whose houses were damaged in a tornado, which has happened via local churches in Moore, Oklahoma.
    Absolutely. [1] Human Beings have flawed characters. Given motive and opportunity, any conceivable social behavior or criminal act can and does happen across the spectrum of religion to the absence of religion. [2] And, establishment minded law abiding, salt of the earth people express their moral standards in all manner of helpful deeds, kindness and generosity.
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    23 Jun '13 20:03
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    All religion is counterfeit and made by men.
    Your thoughts on tithing to a church?
  6. Subscribersonhouse
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    23 Jun '13 21:18
    Originally posted by JS357
    Some of the things that happen in a religion are no better or worse than they would be if they happened outside that religion. Some things are quite admirable. I am thinking of things like a community coming together to help people whose houses were damaged in a tornado, which has happened via local churches in Moore, Oklahoma.
    Tell me, why does doing good have to come from religions? Why can't it come from people simply needing help?
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    23 Jun '13 21:44
    Originally posted by sonhouse
    Tell me, why does doing good have to come from religions? Why can't it come from people simply needing help?
    IMO what's good and evil doesn't come from religion, it goes into religion. Groups enshrine their moral codes (and even manners and customs) in their religion, giving the codes divine and hierarchical authority, and making changes more difficult and more time consuming.

    The stimulus for helping people is two-fold. One is emotional empathy, the other is a kind of insurance for when the helper may need help from the community. The latter might be the source of the former and both may be the result of natural selection.

    That's a naturalistic explanation on the question, to which don't find in myself, belief in a theistic alternative.
  8. Standard memberRJHinds
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    24 Jun '13 03:26
    Originally posted by JS357
    IMO what's good and evil doesn't come from religion, it goes into religion. Groups enshrine their moral codes (and even manners and customs) in their religion, giving the codes divine and hierarchical authority, and making changes more difficult and more time consuming.

    The stimulus for helping people is two-fold. One is emotional empathy, the other is a ki ...[text shortened]... xplanation on the question, to which don't find in myself, belief in a theistic alternative.
    You have many organizations for people to band together outside of religion to forward their political agendas of atheistic manners of social behavior. So do some reseach and join one that suits your fancy.

    The Instructor
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    24 Jun '13 05:453 edits
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    You have many organizations for people to band together outside of religion to forward their political agendas of atheistic manners of social behavior. So do some reseach and join one that suits your fancy.

    The Instructor
    My statement did not even deny that the moral code was from God. It had to do with the institution.

    The thing I find most interesting and sad, in a way, is that there is no Christian here who says, "I get that" to what I say, or who is willing to stand up and reject the kind of blanket condemnation that you present. It seems that the discussion always comes to be dominated by those on the extremes of both sides and we, who are somewhere in between, can't be allowed to be in between. We are cast into the extreme. So should I be here?
  10. Standard memberRJHinds
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    24 Jun '13 08:14
    Originally posted by JS357
    My statement did not even deny that the moral code was from God. It had to do with the institution.

    The thing I find most interesting and sad, in a way, is that there is no Christian here who says, "I get that" to what I say, or who is willing to stand up and reject the kind of blanket condemnation that you present. It seems that the discussion always come ...[text shortened]... etween, can't be allowed to be in between. We are cast into the extreme. So should I be here?
    Christ built His church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it, so who cares about an institution?

    The Instructor
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    24 Jun '13 16:081 edit
    Originally posted by JS357
    My statement did not even deny that the moral code was from God. It had to do with the institution.

    The thing I find most interesting and sad, in a way, is that there is no Christian here who says, "I get that" to what I say, or who is willing to stand up and reject the kind of blanket condemnation that you present. It seems that the discussion always come ...[text shortened]... etween, can't be allowed to be in between. We are cast into the extreme. So should I be here?
    Upon further thought I recall Suzianne standing directly up to Ron to say something to the effect that Ron's remarks and attitudes hurt more than help, in the goal of spreading the Christian message. GB has also been relatively more guided by that goal than Ron seems to be
  12. Standard memberRJHinds
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    24 Jun '13 18:191 edit
    Originally posted by JS357
    Upon further thought I recall Suzianne standing directly up to Ron to say something to the effect that Ron's remarks and attitudes hurt more than help, in the goal of spreading the Christian message. GB has also been relatively more guided by that goal than Ron seems to be
    If I am not spreading the Christian message on RHP, then what do you guys think is that message?

    The Instructor
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    24 Jun '13 18:38
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    If I am not spreading the Christian message on RHP, then what do you guys think is that message?

    The Instructor
    Oh, you know chapters and verses or at least know where to find them, but your supercilious mockery and lack of concern for others, more than that, your active ridicule of others, reveals that you have no real concern for anyone's ultimate fate.
  14. Subscribersonhouse
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    24 Jun '13 18:39
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    If I am not spreading the Christian message on RHP, then what do you guys think is that message?

    The Instructor
    In that regard, do to the lack of success in that endeavor you are in fact one big loser.
  15. Standard memberRJHinds
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    24 Jun '13 19:00
    Originally posted by JS357
    Oh, you know chapters and verses or at least know where to find them, but your supercilious mockery and lack of concern for others, more than that, your active ridicule of others, reveals that you have no real concern for anyone's ultimate fate.
    That is my way of warning them of their ultimate fate in the hope they repent and turn to Christ for salvation.

    The Instructor
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