Spirituality
27 Mar 23
Most mainstream religions follow the “subscription model” I.e. a proselyte becomes attracted to a particular sect, cult, church or whatever, and is encouraged to subscribe to the group’s shared beliefs.
I wonder if this model is waning in these contemporary times of increased exposure to other moralistic influences, different values and critical thinking.
Thoughts?
@divegeester saidI wonder if this model is waning in these contemporary times of increased exposure to other moralistic influences, different values and critical thinking.
Most mainstream religions follow the “subscription model” I.e. a proselyte becomes attracted to a particular sect, cult, church or whatever, and is encouraged to subscribe to the group’s shared beliefs.
I wonder if this model is waning in these contemporary times of increased exposure to other moralistic influences, different values and critical thinking.
Thoughts?
The short answer is No. Many of the "other" moralistic influences, different values and critical thinking concepts you speak of were brought up during the age of enlightenment. The only thing that has changed is the method of communication. Our internet age has made exchanging these ideas much faster - that's all.
@divegeester
I’ve not heard of this - the closest being that I can recall is fishy flirting, can you give an example please ?
27 Mar 23
@divegeester saidI think someone joins a particular denomination of a church based on what he already believes and doesn’t need to be “encouraged to subscribe to the group’s shared beliefs.”
Most mainstream religions follow the “subscription model” I.e. a proselyte becomes attracted to a particular sect, cult, church or whatever, and is encouraged to subscribe to the group’s shared beliefs.
I wonder if this model is waning in these contemporary times of increased exposure to other moralistic influences, different values and critical thinking.
Thoughts?
It’s why most churches on their websites have a statement about what they believe. People want to know about the beliefs of a particular church before they join it.
27 Mar 23
@divegeester saidi was forced into a dingy white van, hooded and beaten, taken to a cave somewhere in the high desert, prolly nevada where i was a sexual slave to three masters and a goddess
Most mainstream religions follow the “subscription model” I.e. a proselyte becomes attracted to a particular sect, cult, church or whatever, and is encouraged to subscribe to the group’s shared beliefs.
I wonder if this model is waning in these contemporary times of increased exposure to other moralistic influences, different values and critical thinking.
Thoughts?
this only lasted a year or so, they got tired of me asking for more
is this what yer talking about?
27 Mar 23
@medullah saidExamples of what specifically please?
@divegeester
I’ve not heard of this - the closest being that I can recall is fishy flirting, can you give an example please ?
28 Mar 23
@divegeester saidFamily and community were once far and away the key reasons [while not the only ones] why people subscribed to particular religions / denominations, and how those belief systems got handed down to younger generations.
Most mainstream religions follow the “subscription model” I.e. a proselyte becomes attracted to a particular sect, cult, church or whatever, and is encouraged to subscribe to the group’s shared beliefs.
I wonder if this model is waning in these contemporary times of increased exposure to other moralistic influences, different values and critical thinking.
Thoughts?
With the rise of atomization, especially ~ but not exclusively ~ in "western" culture, on one hand, there has been an increase in the number of atheists, but on the other hand there has been a move away from old school religions.
More people are shopping around for religious groups and denominations that appeal to them. In many respects, these newer alternative forms of worship, while able to fill gaps in people's lives and create a genuine sense of belonging, they can also be quite hardline and them-or-us-like.
28 Mar 23
@fmf said<<More people are shopping around for religious groups and denominations that appeal to them.>>
Family and community were once far and away the key reasons [while not the only ones] why people subscribed to particular religions / denominations, and how those belief systems got handed down to younger generations.
With the rise of atomization, especially ~ but not exclusively ~ in "western" culture, on one hand, there has been an increase in the number of atheists, but on ...[text shortened]... lives and create a genuine sense of belonging, they can also be quite hardline and them-or-us-like.
Sounds like man trying to define God and make God conform to them, instead of the other way around.
28 Mar 23
@plantermoo saidI am just commenting on trends. Some [or even many] of those people shifting from established churches to their choice from a range of "newer" alternative churches are probably engaged in seeking and finding an approach to God that suits them having been turned off by the churches that were more dominant in the past.
Sounds like man trying to define God and make God conform to them, instead of the other way around.
@plantermoo saidThis is not unilaterally true especially for proselytises who might be attracted by friendship or a sense of inclusion.
I think someone joins a particular denomination of a church based on what he already believes and doesn’t need to be “encouraged to subscribe to the group’s shared beliefs.”
It’s why most churches on their websites have a statement about what they believe. People want to know about the beliefs of a particular church before they join it.
In the case of people who are Christians already, the reason they maybe looking for a different church is that they want to unsubscribe from their current one’s set of beliefs.
Furthermore, why do various Christian churches all from the same religion feel that they need to have a statement of beliefs in the first place and why are they each different.
Your comment underlines the evolving issue rather than negates it.
28 Mar 23
@divegeester said<<Furthermore, why do various Christian churches all from the same religion feel that they need to have a statement of beliefs in the first place and why are they each different.>>
This is not unilaterally true especially for proselytises who might be attracted by friendship or a sense of inclusion.
In the case of people who are Christians already, the reason they maybe looking for a different church is that they want to unsubscribe from their current one’s set of beliefs.
Furthermore, why do various Christian churches all from the same relig ...[text shortened]... d why are they each different.
Your comment underlines the evolving issue rather than negates it.
Because there is disagreement about a lot of doctrines among the various denominations.
Salvation by faith vs. salvation by works
Once saved, always saved vs. conditional salvation
Speaking in tongues vs. not speaking in tongues
Free will in salvation vs. predestination
I’m sure there are more…
@plantermoo saidYes I am sure there are more; the demise of the subscription model is driving and increased number of offerings with modified doctrinal, moral and cultural models.
<<Furthermore, why do various Christian churches all from the same religion feel that they need to have a statement of beliefs in the first place and why are they each different.>>
Because there is disagreement about a lot of doctrines among the various denominations.
Salvation by faith vs. salvation by works
Once saved, always saved vs. conditional salvation
S ...[text shortened]... vs. not speaking in tongues
Free will in salvation vs. predestination
I’m sure there are more…
@divegeester saidPeople are shopping around for religious groups that fill gaps in their lives and create a genuine sense of belonging ~ two needs caused by the decline of more traditional institutions.
Yes I am sure there are more; the demise of the subscription model is driving and increased number of offerings with modified doctrinal, moral and cultural models.
28 Mar 23
@fmf saidIndeed; or staying put and challenging the status quo. However my experience of doing this puts one in a somewhat precarious position with the incumbent subscription model leadership.
People are shopping around for religious groups that fill gaps in their lives and create a genuine sense of belonging ~ two developments caused by the decline of more traditional institutions.
@divegeester saidI don’t think the subscription model exists.
Yes I am sure there are more; the demise of the subscription model is driving and increased number of offerings with modified doctrinal, moral and cultural models.