Is there such a thing as …

@fmf said
What's your answer to this question?

Yes

@kellyjay said
Yes

And what did you want to discuss?

@fmf said
And what did you want to discuss?

The reality of what that means.

@kellyjay said
The reality of what that means.

And what, in your opinion, is the reality of what it means?

@kellyjay said
Yes

Is there such a thing as natural law? Yes.

So, if there is NATURAL law, then people don’t need religion or belief in God to do right and avoid wrong. People should just do what comes naturally. Got it. Next thread.

@moonbus said
Is there such a thing as natural law? Yes.

So, if there is NATURAL law, then people don’t need religion or belief in God to do right and avoid wrong. People should just do what comes naturally. Got it. Next thread.

Really how did nature develop that type of law?

@kellyjay said
Really how did nature develop a law?

Our moral imperatives evolved/developed naturally in us as a communal species because of our cognitive capacities and our survival instinct - known colloquially as the "Golden Rule" and other similar, mostly ubiquitous common sense attendant thereto - and we call that "natural law". That's one possibility.

@fmf said
Our moral imperatives evolved/developed naturally in us as a communal species because of our cognitive capacities and our survival instinct - known colloquially as the "Golden Rule" and other similar, mostly ubiquitous common sense attendant thereto - and we call that "natural law". That's one possibility.

Natural laws that govern behavior are judgment calls, from dead dirt, through chemical reactions by mindless processes without goals, standards, without any means of distinguishing success from failure it just happened?

@kellyjay said
Really how did nature develop that type of law?

Silly question. We've discussed this umpteen times before and there are several equally plausible answers:

a) Nature did not develop, neither did natural laws, it and they have always existed, timelessly.
b) How Nature and natural laws developed is undefined (like division by zero).
c) It does not matter how Nature or natural laws developed.
d) How questions apply only to processes within Nature, not to Nature and its laws.
e) Human beings invented them as shortcuts to describe complex phenomena in simpler terms.

Take your pick. It is all speculation and there is no evidence that Goddidit is the true answer.

@kellyjay said
Natural laws that govern behavior are judgment calls, from dead dirt, through chemical reactions by mindless processes without goals, standards, without any means of distinguishing success from failure it just happened?

That is an over-simplification. "Thou shalt not steal" "thou shalt not kill" "thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife" all have perfectly naturalistic explanations. H. saps. have pretty much the same desires and needs everywhere, that is our common physiology: people do not want to be violated in their bodies, their property, or their spouses. Those who did not care whether their bodies or their property or their spouses were violated did not survive long enough to reproduce, so their genes were eliminated form the gene pool a long time ago. Those who showed care and concern for their bodies, their spouses, and their property not only survived long enough to reproduce, they prospered and thrived and eventually clever men reflected on these matters and codified them in the form of laws to ensure domestic tranquility. It's not just chance, but it does not require divine intervention either.

@kellyjay said
Natural laws that govern behavior are judgment calls, from dead dirt, through chemical reactions by mindless processes without goals, standards, without any means of distinguishing success from failure it just happened?

What do you mean "without goals, standards, without any means of distinguishing success from failure"? How, in your mind, is this string of words connected to what you are ostensibly replying to? The goals, standards, and means of distinguishing success from failure" are EXACTLY what evolved. Did you not understand my post?

@kellyjay said
Natural laws that govern behavior are judgment calls, from dead dirt, through chemical reactions by mindless processes

Are you claiming the human conscience is "mindless"?

@fmf said
Are you claiming the human conscience is "mindless"?

No, only some people are mindless. 😲

@moonbus said
Is there such a thing as natural law? Yes.

So, if there is NATURAL law, then people don’t need religion or belief in God to do right and avoid wrong. People should just do what comes naturally. Got it. Next thread.

Doesn’t help you much