1. Standard memberbill718
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    27 Feb '10 16:24
    It is possible God spoke to the Jews through Moses and the Torah.

    It is possible God spoke to the Gentiles through Jesus and the New Testament.

    It is possible God spoke to the Arab tribes through Mohammed and the Koran.

    It is possible these 3 groups simply have different versions the same message...😏
  2. Donationrwingett
    Ming the Merciless
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    27 Feb '10 16:27
    Originally posted by bill718
    It is possible God spoke to the Jews through Moses and the Torah.

    It is possible God spoke to the Gentiles through Jesus and the New Testament.

    It is possible God spoke to the Arab tribes through Mohammed and the Koran.

    It is possible these 3 groups simply have different versions the same message...😏
    What message can be derived from the harmonization of the three?
  3. Joined
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    27 Feb '10 18:44
    Originally posted by bill718
    It is possible God spoke to the Jews through Moses and the Torah.

    It is possible God spoke to the Gentiles through Jesus and the New Testament.

    It is possible God spoke to the Arab tribes through Mohammed and the Koran.

    It is possible these 3 groups simply have different versions the same message...😏
    ===============================
    It is possible God spoke to the Jews through Moses and the Torah.
    ================================


    Of course He did.

    ====================================
    It is possible God spoke to the Gentiles through Jesus and the New Testament.
    ======================================


    Of course He did this also. The church is one new man where there cannot be Jew and Gentile though.

    =========================================
    It is possible God spoke to the Arab tribes through Mohammed and the Koran.
    ====================================


    My opinion is that God can use many things to "speak" to a person's heart.

    You may see a movie and the Holy Spirit of God may use something about it to speak to you. You may hear a popular song and the Holy Spirit may use something in that song to convict you on a personal level.

    I do not think Mohammed was genuine prophet. But that does not stop God from using something written in the Quran to speak to a God seeking heart.

    God is not restricted in ways of getting through to man's conscience. I think He can use many things.

    ======================================
    It is possible these 3 groups simply have different versions the same message...
    =================================


    Some people would claim that. But it is wishful thinking. The New Testament is the new covenant promised by the Hebrew Bible. It is a step forward. The Quran is an Arabic version of a Moses like law giver. This really a step back.


    Here is what I think has happened. And I could be wrong. You see Abraham had a promise from God to have a son. When he and Sarah his wife went without a child they concocted a plan to use an Egyptian slave as the mother of Abraham's son. This was Ishmael the son of Hagar the Egyptian slave of Abraham.

    We know from the Bible that God told Abraham that that was not the son that God had promised but was his own unfaithful effort. However God did bless Hagar and her son.

    Now Isaac was born as the fulfillment to the aged couple. However, I think that Hagar the mother of Ishmael firmly planted it into her son's mind from very young something like this:

    Don't you ever forget. Your father was the prophet Abraham. Don't let anyone ever tell you different. You are the son of the prophet Abraham. I was your mother. Your father the prophet Abraham had you by me. And don't you ever forget that God blessed you because you were Abraham's son"

    Maybe Hagar the Egyptian mother of Ishmael instilled into her son's mind that he was the promise of God to Abraham for a child. At any rate the old saying is that "The hand that rocks the cradle rules the world".

    This concept got into the psyche of Ishmael and was passed on from generation to generation that there is some prophetic link between the father of the Arabs and the God of Abraham. And there is also a tension between the descendents of Ishmael and those of Isaac.

    Now, I think this is one of the sources of the tension between Jews and Arabs. It is implanted within their belief systems going back to Abraham a real person who was spoken to by a real God.

    I could be wrong. But I think this even has something to do with a Arab Moses like law giver alledgedly from God - Mohammed. It is based in this long standing competition of prophetic closeness of the ancestors of the Jews and that of the Arabs.
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    27 Feb '10 19:04
    Originally posted by bill718
    It is possible God spoke to the Jews through Moses and the Torah.

    It is possible God spoke to the Gentiles through Jesus and the New Testament.

    It is possible God spoke to the Arab tribes through Mohammed and the Koran.

    It is possible these 3 groups simply have different versions the same message...😏
    No.

    What the other two are missing is the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ.
  5. At the Revolution
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    27 Feb '10 20:12
    Originally posted by bill718
    It is possible God spoke to the Jews through Moses and the Torah.

    It is possible God spoke to the Gentiles through Jesus and the New Testament.

    It is possible God spoke to the Arab tribes through Mohammed and the Koran.

    It is possible these 3 groups simply have different versions the same message...😏
    It is true, not just possible.
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    27 Feb '10 20:39
    Originally posted by jaywill
    [b]===============================
    It is possible God spoke to the Jews through Moses and the Torah.
    ================================


    Of course He did.

    ====================================
    It is possible God spoke to the Gentiles through Jesus and the New Testament.
    ======================================


    Of course ...[text shortened]... etition of prophetic closeness of the ancestors of the Jews and that of the Arabs.[/b]
    "My opinion is that God can use many things to "speak" to a person's heart."

    You may want to re-examine your position here. Outside of nature God speaks through His word exclusively.

    There may be a symantical discrepancy here, so let's be clear. You said above that there is the "one new man". It is the "one new man" that is built up and nerished by the word of God.

    The Koran may contain some truth and even some passages that are in the Bible, but it is not THE word of God.

    IMO a Christian should not equivocate on this. It is the Bible exclusively that contains the word of God, and all the doctrine for life and faith.

    I hope you're not offended by my thoughts jaywill.
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    27 Feb '10 21:01
    Is it possible for blowhards to draw any conclusion they like from any circumstance presented to them? Your question answers itself. What is the point in asking it?
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    27 Feb '10 23:14
    Originally posted by TerrierJack
    Is it possible for blowhards to draw any conclusion they like from any circumstance presented to them? Your question answers itself. What is the point in asking it?
    Did you learn that from first hand experience? πŸ™‚
  9. Standard memberbill718
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    28 Feb '10 23:29
    Originally posted by josephw
    [b]"My opinion is that God can use many things to "speak" to a person's heart."

    You may want to re-examine your position here. Outside of nature God speaks through His word exclusively.

    There may be a symantical discrepancy here, so let's be clear. You said above that there is the "one new man". It is the "one new man" that is built up and nerished ...[text shortened]... he doctrine for life and faith.

    I hope you're not offended by my thoughts jaywill.[/b]
    You said "The Koran may contain some truth and even some passages that are in the Bible, but it is not THE word of God"... How you you know this?? I am a Christian, but I'm convinced God speaks to people in different ways, and I believe it is possible that God spoke to the Arab tribes through the Koran😏
  10. Donationrwingett
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    01 Mar '10 00:55
    Originally posted by bill718
    You said "The Koran may contain some truth and even some passages that are in the Bible, but it is not THE word of God"... How you you know this?? I am a Christian, but I'm convinced God speaks to people in different ways, and I believe it is possible that God spoke to the Arab tribes through the Koran😏
    What purpose would god have in talking to people in different ways? To confuse them and breed discord? If so he has certainly succeeded. Why would he tell one group something that is wholly incompatible with what he tells another? If salvation comes through the death and resurrection of Jesus, then to not make that point clear to everyone seems a rather curious omission.

    The state of affairs in the world does not at all seem as though there is one god telling people different things. It seems much more likely that there is no god talking to anyone and that people are just making stuff up as they go along.
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    01 Mar '10 01:08
    Originally posted by rwingett
    What purpose would god have in talking to people in different ways? To confuse them and breed discord? If so he has certainly succeeded. Why would he tell one group something that is wholly incompatible with what he tells another? If salvation comes through the death and resurrection of Jesus, then to not make that point clear to everyone seems a rather cur ...[text shortened]... hat there is no god talking to anyone and that people are just making stuff up as they go along.
    can i have your address, i want to personally evangelise to you.
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    01 Mar '10 01:09
    Originally posted by rwingett
    What purpose would god have in talking to people in different ways? To confuse them and breed discord? If so he has certainly succeeded. Why would he tell one group something that is wholly incompatible with what he tells another? If salvation comes through the death and resurrection of Jesus, then to not make that point clear to everyone seems a rather cur ...[text shortened]... hat there is no god talking to anyone and that people are just making stuff up as they go along.
    You are so rational rwingett. Why haven't you believed yet?

    I think you will, eventually. πŸ˜‰
  13. Donationrwingett
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    01 Mar '10 01:50
    Originally posted by josephw
    You are so rational rwingett. Why haven't you believed yet?

    I think you will, eventually. πŸ˜‰
    Maybe if Christianity is updated to a Pantheist, Bishop Spong, Liberation Theology combination. The miracles, virgin birth, death and resurrection, any literal interpretations of heaven and hell, and generally anything smacking of the supernatural are right out, though.
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    01 Mar '10 08:131 edit
    Originally posted by josephw
    You are so rational rwingett. Why haven't you believed yet?
    Presumably because religion is generally irrational. I am yet to meet a Christian that when confronted by rational challenges to their beliefs doesn't eventually hide behind the "God is bound by your laws of logic" defense.
  15. Standard memberkaroly aczel
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    01 Mar '10 10:50
    Originally posted by rwingett
    What purpose would god have in talking to people in different ways? To confuse them and breed discord? If so he has certainly succeeded. Why would he tell one group something that is wholly incompatible with what he tells another? If salvation comes through the death and resurrection of Jesus, then to not make that point clear to everyone seems a rather cur ...[text shortened]... hat there is no god talking to anyone and that people are just making stuff up as they go along.
    Indeed rwingwett, a lot of the origonal meaning is lost in the translation of pure thought information into the linear,block-like language of humans. Still you cant blame people for trying.
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