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    13 Jun '13 09:30
    What do you think of Christians who rely heavily on the new testament, try to extend it?

    I mean Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses in particular? (are there more?)

    The Mormons in the book of Mormon from what I can gather have a new New Testament. I think this a good idea to be honest - its much more important to Christianity then the eclectic Old Testament to me.

    What do you think of such Churches - can you name more?
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    ?
  3. Joined
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    13 Jun '13 10:09
    Originally posted by e4chris
    What do you think of Christians who rely heavily on the new testament, try to extend it?

    I mean Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses in particular? (are there more?)

    The Mormons in the book of Mormon from what I can gather have a new New Testament. I think this a good idea to be honest - its much more important to Christianity then the eclectic Old Testament to me.

    What do you think of such Churches - can you name more?
    What is it you want to explore here, and why.
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    14 Jun '13 01:26
    Originally posted by divegeester
    What is it you want to explore here, and why.
    Maybe the thread title sounds stupid; but my crude understanding of the Bible is as follows...

    Old Testament = Jewish History & Morality
    New Testament = Jesus Christ

    In the church I go to all the singing is dedicated to Christ, but about 80% of the bible is Jewish and not relevant to Jesus Teachings. My impression of Mormons is they tried to turn Biblical study towards the New Testament by providing a new modern prophet along those lines. There founder was shot for it.

    I find the History of the Old Testament amazing but the morality stone age , from a time when they really did crack rocks. It really does not work for the 20th / 21st Century but I think Jesus teaching are very relevant and under rated in the modern world.

    So I guess I'm asking is that view of Mormons correct and are there other Churches like that?
  5. Standard memberRemoved
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    14 Jun '13 01:38
    Originally posted by e4chris
    Maybe the thread title sounds stupid; but my crude understanding of the Bible is as follows...

    Old Testament = Jewish History & Morality
    New Testament = Jesus Christ

    In the church I go to all the singing is dedicated to Christ, but about 80% of the bible is Jewish and not relevant to Jesus Teachings. My impression of Mormons is they tried to turn Bibl ...[text shortened]...
    So I guess I'm asking is that view of Mormons correct and are there other Churches like that?
    The Old Testament is about Jesus Christ. The subject of the entire bible from Genesis 3:15 to Revelation 22:21 is Jesus Christ.
    Many people have problems understanding the bible because of this....

    Proverbs 25:2
    It is the glory of God to conceal a matter; to search out a matter
    is the glory of kings.

    God had concealed things in Scripture in such a way as to destroy
    the wisdom of the “wise” of this world, and frustrate the intelligence of
    the intelligent (1 Cor. 1:19). However, to those people who approach
    the Bible with humility, prayer, and faith, God reveals what He has
    concealed, and the Word of God fits together perfectly, without problem
    or contradiction.
    Study the book, pray and ask God to help you understand it. Find a good church, if you are not growing there, find another, but don't give up.
  6. Standard memberRJHinds
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    14 Jun '13 03:081 edit
    Make sure the church acknowledges the Triune God and honors the Son as they honor the Father. Stay away from the false teachings of the Mormons and the Jehovah's Witnesses. They will just confuse you.

    The Instructor
  7. Standard membervivify
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    14 Jun '13 03:18
    According to the bible, Jesus used OT scripture to validate himself, by citing OT prophesies as proof of being the Messiah; he also got into debates where he used to OT scripture to "silence" his opposers. Furthermore, he battled against Satan's temptations in the desert, using OT scripture.

    So the OT is a huge part of Christianity.
  8. Standard memberRJHinds
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    14 Jun '13 03:32
    Originally posted by vivify
    According to the bible, Jesus used OT scripture to validate himself, by citing OT prophesies as proof of being the Messiah; he also got into debates where he used to OT scripture to "silence" his opposers. Furthermore, he battled against Satan's temptations in the desert, using OT scripture.

    So the OT is a huge part of Christianity.
    Yes that is right. The Jews do not acknowledge all of the Old Testament scriptures and interpret those they do acknowledge to remove the possibility that any of it refers to Jesus as the Christ. Many of them are like the Muslims and do not acknowledge that God has a Son. They are basically both antichrist religions.

    The Instructor
  9. Standard memberSwissGambit
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    14 Jun '13 04:50
    The two Testaments are interesting, each in its own way. The Old one gives us a picture of these people's Deity as he was before he got religion, the other one gives us a picture of him as he appeared afterward. The Old Testament is interested mainly in blood and sensuality. The New one in Salvation. Salvation by fire.

    The first time the Deity came down to earth, he brought life and death; when he came the second time, he brought hell.

    Life was not a valuable gift, but death was. Life was a fever-dream made up of joys embittered by sorrows, pleasure poisoned by pain, a dream that was a nightmare-confusion of spasmodic and fleeting delights, ecstasies, exultations, happinesses, interspersed with long-drawn miseries, griefs, perils, horrors, disappointments, defeats, humiliations, and despairs -- the heaviest curse devisable by divine ingenuity; but death was sweet, death was gentle, death was kind; death healed the bruised spirit and the broken heart, and gave them rest and forgetfulness; death was man's best friend; when man could endure life no longer, death came and set him free.

    In time, the Deity perceived that death was a mistake; a mistake, in that it was insufficient; insufficient, for the reason that while it was an admirable agent for the inflicting of misery upon the survivor, it allowed the dead person himself to escape from all further persecution in the blessed refuge of the grave. This was not satisfactory. A way must be conceived to pursue the dead beyond the tomb.

    The Deity pondered this matter during four thousand years unsuccessfully, but as soon as he came down to earth and became a Christian his mind cleared and he knew what to do. He invented hell, and proclaimed it.

    Now here is a curious thing. It is believed by everybody that while he was in heaven he was stern, hard, resentful, jealous, and cruel; but that when he came down to earth and assumed the name Jesus Christ, he became the opposite of what he was before: that is to say, he became sweet, and gentle, merciful, forgiving, and all harshness disappeared from his nature and a deep and yearning love for his poor human children took its place. Whereas it was as Jesus Christ that he devised hell and proclaimed it!

    Which is to say, that as the meek and gentle Savior he was a thousand billion times crueler than ever he was in the Old Testament -- oh, incomparably more atrocious than ever he was when he was at the very worst in those old days!

    -Mark Twain
    excerpt from Letters from the Earth
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    14 Jun '13 07:17
    Originally posted by e4chris
    Maybe the thread title sounds stupid; but my crude understanding of the Bible is as follows...

    Old Testament = Jewish History & Morality
    New Testament = Jesus Christ

    In the church I go to all the singing is dedicated to Christ, but about 80% of the bible is Jewish and not relevant to Jesus Teachings. My impression of Mormons is they tried to turn Bibl ...[text shortened]...
    So I guess I'm asking is that view of Mormons correct and are there other Churches like that?
    What denomination church do you attend?

    Did you ask the elders these questions?
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    14 Jun '13 20:341 edit
    Originally posted by divegeester
    What denomination church do you attend?

    Did you ask the elders these questions?
    The Nazarene Church, no not as such, we have discussed it a bit.

    They are like most churches very focused on Jesus in the services. still the Bible is 'The Word' - faith in Jesus without it, I'm quite interested in , and its not a big discussion there. Even though I'd call them progressive.
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    14 Jun '13 22:13
    Originally posted by e4chris
    The Nazarene Church, no not as such, we have discussed it a bit.

    They are like most churches very focused on Jesus in the services. still the Bible is 'The Word' - faith in Jesus without it, I'm quite interested in , and its not a big discussion there. Even though I'd call them progressive.
    I've looked at the website to try to understand what his church stands for/believes but it doesn't say. Can you enlighten?
  13. Standard memberRJHinds
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    14 Jun '13 22:34
    Originally posted by divegeester
    I've looked at the website to try to understand what his church stands for/believes but it doesn't say. Can you enlighten?
    These are the beliefs Nazarenes hold to be true:

    We believe in one God-the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.

    We believe that the Old and New Testament Scriptures, given by plenary inspiration, contain all truth necessary to faith and Christian living.

    We believe that man is born with a fallen nature, and is, therefore, inclined to evil, and that continually.

    We believe that the finally impenitent are hopelessly and eternally lost.

    We believe that the atonement through Jesus Christ is for the whole human race; and that whosoever repents and believes on the Lord Jesus Christ is justified and regenerated and saved from the dominion of sin.

    We believe that believers are to be sanctified wholly, subsequent to regeneration, through faith in the Lord Jesus Christ.

    We believe that the Holy Spirit bears witness to the new birth, and also to the entire sanctification of believers.

    We believe that our Lord will return, the dead will be raised, and the final judgment will take place.

    http://nazarene.org/ministries/administration/visitorcenter/beliefs/display.html

    Two Nazarene beliefs set this Christian denomination apart from other evangelicals: the belief that a person can experience entire sanctification, or personal holiness, in this life, and the belief that a saved person can lose their salvation through sin.

    Sacraments - Nazarenes baptize both infants and adults. If parents choose to delay baptism, a dedication ceremony is available. The applicant, parent, or guardian may choose sprinkling, pouring, or immersion.

    Local churches vary on how often they administer the sacrament of the Lord's Supper, some only four times a year and others as often as weekly. All believers present, regardless of whether they are members of the local church, are invited to partake. The minister says a prayer of consecration, then distributes the two emblems of communion (bread and wine) to the people, with the help of other ministers or stewards. Only unfermented wine is used in this sacrament.

    http://christianity.about.com/od/Nazarene-Church/a/Nazarene-Beliefs.htm

    The Instructor
  14. Joined
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    14 Jun '13 23:06
    Originally posted by divegeester
    I've looked at the website to try to understand what his church stands for/believes but it doesn't say. Can you enlighten?
    The Pastor advocates going out for meals, to the cinema, socialising and fun as part of being Christian so that's quite cool, there's a good social scene around the church, they're quite modern in some of the songs they sing and the use of power point , amused me 🙂 But also quite conservative on some issues, I didn't pick them for there politics or as a denomination as such, they have a good reputation and are very near me too. When they started they advocated teetotalism and a few of the hymns are by Charles Wesley.
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    15 Jun '13 20:402 edits
    Not much I post on here is like what's said in church, Church is the best of the Bible and Hymns and coffee, its more modern then it sounds.

    To be honest if the church 'elders' spoke up on here they might well sound like Robbie Carrobie! a few of them, why I like his posts, some are more sane and a few academics.
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