Koran-vs-Bible

Originally posted by dannyUchiha
I guess I learned a valuable lesson from this debate. The "truth" is nothing than an individualist point of view, which people get inspired to find through the Bible, Qu'ran, and other books.

To tell the truth, all your arguments make plausible the possibility that even a comic book can hold the truth, should we choose to see it that way.

So I gue ...[text shortened]... inst this on this debate.

What do you guys think of this? Feedback is always welcome.

I think that your own reason, knowledge and will are a better guide to the truth than any written text. You are responsible for yourself regardless of any particular book. If you claim not to be then please move far away from other humans - you are a danger to them.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
look noobster, you have not read the account, that is obvious, otherwise you would not be spouting your nonsense, it was because they had a community responsibility to look after travelers etc, what is it about that you do not understand, 'community spirit', what are you talking about? are you sure you felt your bum?if you are not going to read the passage, do not waste my time with lies, half baked conceptions and outright nonsense.

'lies, half baked conceptions and outright nonsense', hmmmmm.....that to me is what the Bible is. But anyway back to this charming story.

So let me get this correct, the man had taken in guests, and rather give them to the 'sons of Belial' who had coming knocking on his door, he through them his daughter instead. Whereupon she was essentially gang-raped all night until she was dead. And that is what you call community spirit? Charming, it's not very endearing this Christian malarky so far.

So now, this old chap decided to cut up his daughter, who he had thrown out the front door to a bunch of men who gang-raped her to death, into 12 pieces and sent them to the coasts of Israel.
This so enraged the tribes of Israel they rose up as one to avenge this act 'for they have committed lewdness and folly in Israel'. The children of Benjamin though wouldn't give up the men who had committed the crime so the battle lines were drawn. The children of Israel went to the the Lord to ask who should fight first, 'Judah' was the reply and off they went to battle and promptly had twenty-two thousand men killed. They then went to the Lord again and this time asked 'shall I again draw near for battle against the children of my brother Benjamin?'. 'Go up against him' was the reply, and this time eighteen thousand were killed.

Maybe it's me but i would be looking for someone else to ask advice if i had had 40,000 men killed in two days of battle??

So after all that bloodshed on the third day God decided 'go up for tomorrow i will deliver them into your hand', and all but 600 hundred Benjamites were 'drew to the sword' and 'they also set fire to all the cities they came to'.

What a delightful tale, gang-rape, revenge, mass murder, a God who sits by and watches tens of thousands of people hacked to death with swords. You wanted me to reveal what happened Robster, frankly if i were you i would have left it at the gang-rape, the full version is even more barbaric.

Originally posted by Proper Knob
What a delightful tale, gang-rape, revenge, mass murder, a God who sits by and watches tens of thousands of people hacked to death with swords. You wanted me to reveal what happened Robster, frankly if i were you i would have left it at the gang-rape, the full version is even more barbaric.

Never mind the fact that the hero of the story is the guy who gave up his loved one for the rape! But heck, she was only a woman! After all, a good cigar is a smoke!

Originally posted by znsho
...that is, to me, is very strong evidence that a human wrote the Qur'an.

All books are written by humans.

You can use the edit function for up to one hour after posting, to expunge silly statements from your text.

I do it all the time - not often enough sometimes!

Originally posted by TerrierJack
Never mind the fact that the hero of the story is the guy who gave up his loved one for the rape! But heck, she was only a woman! After all, a good cigar is a smoke!

There is a difference between what the Bible teaches and what the Bible records as having happened,

David, had a man killed so he could rob him of his wife. The story is told in all of its candor. He is not spared the frank exposure of his hypocrisy even though he was a national hero. And he was a hero of the faith.

His failure with Bethseba is recorded with all candidness for the warning of others of faith to follow after.

It is rather immature to gloat over that and think that what David did is portrayed as a postive example to follow. This is not soberminded.

The realism of the failures of some of the people of faith is not an example for others to follow but a warning of what to avoid.

Isn't it a little warped for people to hoot down the Bible because it recorded a bad event, and that done by someone who should have known better?

Originally posted by jaywill
Isn't it a little warped for people to hoot down the Bible because it recorded a bad event, and that done by someone who should have known better?

Isn't it a little warped for people to hoot down the Al Quran because it recorded a bad event, and that done by someone who should have known better?

Originally posted by FMF
Isn't it a little warped for people to hoot down the Al Quran because it recorded a bad event, and that done by someone who should have known better?

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Isn't it a little warped for people to hoot down the Al Quran because it recorded a bad event, and that done by someone who should have known better?
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Where did I hoot down the Quran because it recorded a bad event in this discussion?

May I have you quote me please? Either in this thread or in another, where did I ridicule the Quran because it recorded a bad event ?

Now, I have yet to read the entire Quran. But according to the Moslem's I have had conversations with, it is unspeakable to them that a PROPHET should have a sin.

They very much object (at least one or two I debated with) to the idea that a prophet would do some of the things which the Bible says holy men did in their failures.

But aside from this, I expect you to demonstrate where I hooted down the Quran for a passage about a bad event.

Originally posted by jaywill
[b]=============================
Isn't it a little warped for people to hoot down the Al Quran because it recorded a bad event, and that done by someone who should have known better?
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Where did I hoot down the Quran because it recorded a bad event in this discussion?[/b]

I just asked you a straight question about "people" in response to your question about "people". Please ignore me if you are going to insist on fielding every question and comment as if it is a personal attack.

Originally posted by utherpendragon
I see your humor,but the irony is thats really whats going on.from the crusades to the present

Well not really. I'm not aware of any Christian nations slaughtering and oppressing Muslim nations based on religious grounds. The Muslims on the other hand are still crusading and marauding like it's still the 6th century.

Don't get me wrong; the US, considered by some as a Christian nation and by others as not, does indirectly oppress Muslims with its support of Israel and with the use of sanctions and political pressure... but thats certainly not any kind of Crusade.

Originally posted by FMF
All books are written by humans.

You can use the edit function for up to one hour after posting, to expunge silly statements from your text.

I do it all the time - not often enough sometimes!

Of couse all books are written (authored) by humans - that's my point!!!!

Originally posted by znsho
Of couse all books are written (authored) by humans - that's my point!!!!

Mmm and ( znsho: "...that is, to me, is very strong evidence that a human wrote the Qur'an..." ) you have been busy presenting "evidence" that all books are written by humans. Good for you.

So what IS your point then?

Are some books more written by humans than others? Do you have "evidence" of this too?

Originally posted by FMF
Mmm and ( znsho: "...that is, to me, is very strong evidence that a human wrote the Qur'an..." ) you have been busy presenting "evidence" that all books are written by humans. Good for you.

So what IS your point then?

Are some books more written by humans than others? Do you have "evidence" of this too?

Your apparent inability to undertsand makes me wonder:

Are you really that stupid?

The answer must be no. So I conclude: You are a wind-up artist.

I wish I was Basil Fawlty and you were Manuel, when Basil says 'Let me explain, Manuel..' He then pokes him in the eye.

I will try to explain in simple terms:

1) Many Muslims believe the Qur'an to be AUTHORED by Allah via Gabriel via MoMo.

2) In fact, many people believe the Bible (Old and New) and the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.

3) People such as myself do not believe 1 and 2 above

(FMF, are you still with me?)

4) For various reasons, too detailed to go into here, people such as myself wish to demonstrate to devout religious peoples that the books they follow were, in fact, written by humans, not Allah / God. More specifically, Allah / God do (does) not exist.

5) To this end, we point out things that should make it obvious that the Book was writtten by a human (s).

In this thread, I have given an example.

Finally, FMF, it is not me you should be telling 'it is iobvious books were written by humans', it is your fellow Muslims / Christians etc etc you should be telling this to.

Originally posted by FMF
I just asked you a straight question about "people" in response to your question about "people". Please ignore me if you are going to insist on fielding every question and comment as if it is a personal attack.

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I just asked you a straight question about "people" in response to your question about "people". Please ignore me if you are going to insist on fielding every question and comment as if it is a personal attack.
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You have attacked me in the past. So maybe if you hadn't displayed that tendency perhaps I would not be defensively on guard about it.

.........error........

Originally posted by utherpendragon
is the Koran superior to the Bible and if so,why? Is the Bible superior and if so,why? Are they equal? Why?

The Bible is superior to the Koran!

The Bible was written by 40 different authors
The Koran was written by one (who by the way couldn't read or write).

Some of the Bible's authors contributed eye witness accounts of what they saw and witnessed (ie: Jesus crucifixion & ressurection)
The Koran was dictated by Muhammed to those who could write and there were no eye witness accounts.

The Bible's Old Testament points toward the Messiah and the New Testament points toward Christ as the Messiah. It all has the same theme.
The Koran is all over the place and doesn't hold one theme throughout.

The Bible was written over a period of thousands of years.
The Koran was written all at the same time

The Bible is historically accurate
The Koran is not.

The Bible provides truth
The Koran does not.

The Bible provides a way for salvation through Christ
The Koran does not.