1. Standard memberDasa
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    27 Sep '15 14:37
    Matter and God

    Q: In term so modern scientific reasoning, it can be explained that matter or substance is essentially mankind and all the material worlds. Gravity, which is related to matter is essentially the power of God. Gravity is omnipotent, omnipresent and omnivalent. So in my scientific opinion, I believe, that God and gravitation are synonymous. Could you comment?

    A: The Vedic opinion, although also scientific, is slightly different. The Vedic science operates under opposite paradigm from the modern science: it is God-centered, whereas the modern science tries to explain away God. If we are to judge by the results, the modern science tends to aggravate the problems rather than to solve them.

    Mankind, or human being, is composed not only of matter (body) as you say but also of an immaterial substance (jiva, sometimes called "soul", but this term is not precisely defined in Western philosophies/theologies). This substance is us, or "I", whereas the material body we call "ours". To understand their difference is the first step in Vedic education.

    Yes, gravitation is a power of God and thus it is different from God. According to the Vedic view, sakti (energy) and saktiman (source of energy) are both different and non-different. Example often given is that of milk: milk is the energy of cow, thus in one sense it is non-different from cow; in other sense it is not the cow. Milk depends on the cow - there is no milk without a cow but there are cows without milk. So shakti is subordinate to its source.

    Gravitation is one of the energies of God. If we speak about the law of gravitation, then there must naturally be a lawmaker. To claim that something appears by chance or out of nothing is unscientific. It cannot be demonstrated or proven. In this case the lawmaker is God Himself, the Supreme Person (Purusottama).

    Bhagavata Purana (Srimad Bhagavatam) 3.13.42:

    O Lord, for the residential purposes of all inhabitants, both moving and nonmoving, this earth is Your wife, and You are the supreme father. We offer our respectful obeisances unto You, along with mother earth, in whom You have invested Your own potency, just as an expert sacrificer puts fire in the arani wood.

    Purport:

    The so-called law of gravitation which sustains the planets is described herein as the potency of the Lord. This potency is invested by the Lord in the way that an expert sacrificial brahmana puts fire in the arani wood by the potency of Vedic mantras. By this arrangement the world becomes habitable for both the moving and nonmoving creatures. The conditioned souls, who are residents of the material world, are put in the womb of mother earth in the same way the seed of a child is put by the father in the womb of the mother. This conception of the Lord and the earth as father and mother is explained in Bhagavad-gita (14.4). Conditioned souls are devoted to the motherland in which they take their birth, but they do not know their father. The mother is not independent in producing children. Similarly, material nature cannot produce living creatures unless in contact with the supreme father, the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Srimad-Bhagavatam teaches us to offer obeisances unto the mother along with the Father, the Supreme Lord, because it is the Father only who impregnates the mother with all energies for the sustenance and maintenance of all living beings, both moving and nonmoving.

    This particular energy, gravitation, belongs to a form of the Lord called Sankarsana.

    SB 4.24.35:
    My dear Lord, You are the origin of the subtle material ingredients, the master of all integration as well as the master of all disintegration, the predominating Deity named Sankarsana, and the master of all intelligence, known as the predominating Deity Pradyumna. Therefore, I offer my respectful obeisances unto You.

    Purport:

    The whole universe is maintained by the integrating power of the Supreme Lord, who is known in that capacity by the name Sankarsana. The material scientists may have discovered the law of gravity, which maintains the integration of objects within the material energy, yet the master of all integration can create devastation by the disintegrating blazing fire emanating from His mouth. A description of this can be found in the Eleventh Chapter of Bhagavad-gita, wherein the universal form of the Lord is described. The master of integration is also the destroyer of this world by virtue of His disintegrating energy. Sankarsana is the master of integration and disintegration, whereas Pradyumna, another feature of Lord Vasudeva, is responsible for universal growth and maintenance. The word suksmaya is significant because within this gross material body there are subtle material bodies - namely mind, intelligence and ego. The Lord in His different features (Vasudeva, Aniruddha, Pradyumna and Sankarsana) maintains both the gross and subtle material elements of this world. As mentioned in Bhagavad-gita, the gross material elements are earth, water, fire, air and ether, and the subtle material elements are mind, intelligence and ego. All of them are controlled by the Supreme Personality of Godhead as Vasudeva, Sankarsana, Pradyumna and Aniruddha, and this will be further explained in the following verse.

    From the Vedas.
  2. Mar-a-Lago
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  3. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    28 Sep '15 05:55
    Originally posted by Dasa
    ... So in my scientific opinion, I believe, that God and gravitation are synonymous. Could you comment?

    Your scientific opinion?
  4. Subscribersonhouse
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    28 Sep '15 12:41
    Originally posted by Dasa
    Matter and God

    Q: In term so modern scientific reasoning, it can be explained that matter or substance is essentially mankind and all the material worlds. Gravity, which is related to matter is essentially the power of God. Gravity is omnipotent, omnipresent and omnivalent. So in my scientific opinion, I believe, that God and gravitation are synonymous. Coul ...[text shortened]... mna and Aniruddha, and this will be further explained in the following verse.

    From the Vedas.
    Gravity is not all powerful, because an ordinary refrigerator magnet holds itself up on the refrigerator against the combined gravity caused by the mass of the entire planet Earth.

    Gravity is certainly all pervasive but there are science theories, as yet unproven and not much evidence, that the weakness we see in gravity compared to the fundamental strength of electric fields or magnetic fields, according to some theories, is there are multiple dimensions in the universe, and perhaps many many universes and the reason gravity is so weak compared to magnetic fields is that gravity IS all pervasive, present in ALL dimensions and thus is sharing its power amongst what some folks say are as many as 12 extra dimensions. Even that doesn't explain the weakness of gravity compared to electric or magnetic fields. The power of say, a one kilogram ordinary magnet is by far stronger locally than the entire gravitational pull of Earth.
  5. Standard memberDasa
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    28 Sep '15 13:182 edits
    Originally posted by sonhouse
    Gravity is not all powerful, because an ordinary refrigerator magnet holds itself up on the refrigerator against the combined gravity caused by the mass of the entire planet Earth.

    Gravity is certainly all pervasive but there are science theories, as yet unproven and not much evidence, that the weakness we see in gravity compared to the fundamental stren ...[text shortened]... kilogram ordinary magnet is by far stronger locally than the entire gravitational pull of Earth.
    This is the remarkable and amazing thing about just one of the powers of the Lord, that keeps all the water in our oceans from floating out into space..

    How heavy is all the water in the oceans and lakes and rivers, that is kept clinging to the earths surface by gravity, and yet it doesn't interfere with the millions of fridge magnets stuck to fridges all around the world.

    I would say that gravity can seem like a very powerful force when it wants to.
  6. Standard memberDasa
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    28 Sep '15 13:23
    Originally posted by wolfgang59
    Your scientific opinion?
    Surprising isn't it.
  7. Subscribersonhouse
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    28 Sep '15 14:10
    Originally posted by Dasa
    This is the remarkable and amazing thing about just one of the powers of the Lord, that keeps all the water in our oceans from floating out into space..

    How heavy is all the water in the oceans and lakes and rivers, that is kept clinging to the earths surface by gravity, and yet it doesn't interfere with the millions of fridge magnets stuck to fridges all ar ...[text shortened]... und the world.

    I would say that gravity can seem like a very powerful force when it wants to.
    It isn't a matter of 'wants to', it is strictly a matter of how much mass is concentrated in how much volume. Einstein showed gravity is not a force. It is a reaction to the local concentration of matter which bends space itself. Space is not a rigid piece of hardware, it is more like molasses, it flows, it bends, it stretches and it stretches time as well as showing what we think of as a force. But think of a child's slide. The child goes on the slide which is a slippery metal surface at an angle and the bending of space in the vicinity of Earth is like that tilted slide. There is no force applied to the child other than gravity and it is only the reaction to the amount of bending of the slide above horizontal that says how fast the child will descend down the slide. Gravity didn't change, only the amount of the angle verses horizontal that changed.

    Gravity is like that, where the angle of the bending of space in the vicinity of Earth says how fast things will slide towards Earth from space.

    The bending of space around Mars is about 1/3 that of Earth because the average density of Mars rocks is somewhat like the average density of Earth rocks but it is a lot smaller and therefore has 1/3 or so of the mass of the Earth. That means the bending of space in the area around mars is less so we see less sliding down to the surface of Mars.
  8. Mar-a-Lago
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    28 Sep '15 16:24
    Originally posted by sonhouse
    Gravity is not all powerful, because an ordinary refrigerator magnet holds itself up on the refrigerator against the combined gravity caused by the mass of the entire planet Earth.

    Gravity is certainly all pervasive but there are science theories, as yet unproven and not much evidence, that the weakness we see in gravity compared to the fundamental stren ...[text shortened]... kilogram ordinary magnet is by far stronger locally than the entire gravitational pull of Earth.
    Nice post but I fear science will de lost on Dashund.
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