Originally posted by twhitehead
No, I am not misunderstanding. Quantum interference occurs whether or not you have the necessary mathematical knowledge and whether or not you directly observe it happening or interpret it as such.
Light travels as a wave. This is a quantum phenomena. When light is refracted by glass, for example, this is a quantum phenomena. It doesn't need your mind or ...[text shortened]... place in the whole thing is egoistic and a total misunderstanding of the phenomena in question.
I have explored but never been fully convinced of the so-called 'observer effect' as a good explanation, if there is one. It is based still in an A follows B paradigm. It appears to me that decoherence is happening outside of human mentation as well. bb points more to the way I interpret what is 'happening' in the specific experimental set ups - we being 'involved' with the fact that we are already a part of the all interacting quantum context of the conduct of the experiments and interpretation.
This appears to me to also be reflected in Heisenberg's realization of indeterminancy. The inherent inability to measure both momentum and location at the same time is because the measuring enters and confounds the present quantum moment and its probabilities. I believe that is not the only reason, but I can't explain that further, but I do see a connection..
As I say, I do not see that human mentation 'causes' collapse. But saying that and agreeing with you to a point, it still doesn't explain why for instance, certain photons participate in the reflection and others with the exact same properties do not. Who or what is choosing which one goes through the glass and which ones do not? I don't actually think anything or anybody is choosing, but it is a property of the global quantum field that includes the object, the light the reflection and the observer making sense with his brain in a quantum gestalt, the one that is ever bringing into existent every moment.
Likewise, the set up of an experiment and its interpretation happens in a field with non-locality qualities that has been shown to demonstrate effects that imply a state outside of time and space. This is reflected in tunnelling behavior, where impossibly to classical physics, the electron can appear where it shouldn't simply because that there is some probability/possibility of that occurring (shown in the calculation of the wf).
I believe the field does not HAVE classical properties but is the field out of which the high probability classical properties emerge. This field 'resonates' in constant moment to moment ferment, connecting, informing , holding that information (meaning) in concert with everything else in every other "time" and "place" holistically. It is a holomovement of timeless non-locality which is more akin in its nature to the properties of consciousness, but is NOT a separate consciousness but is reflected in all manifestations of meaning, information, connection etc, sentient and non-sentient. There is information and order in a rock and a hell of a lot of 'energy' in stasis. From one viewpoint a nuclear explosion is a very rapid reorganization, re-patterning and re-informing - a rapid change of meaning.
Yes, we are here, but as we dig deeper and deeper we apparently disappear into the void of our being - yet we still are. Unlocatable 'wave' and locatable 'particle' as it were, both at each reappearing moment. and its the same for the rocks with no brains at all! Its not regarded as a 'floating world', a 'magic' for nothing in Buddhist/Taoist circles. Some in the old classical scientific world have glimpsed it. They have not disposed of scientific function and mathematical story but rather are better able to understand 'existence' and its manifestation and work within it better. The amazing technology arising out of quantum findings is a testament to that.
Just sharing how what I know (or think I know) thus far seem to gel together the best way.
PS I use the term "field" loosely - I must use some epiphet to point to this somewhat indescribable, outside of time and space phenomenon.