1. Joined
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    19 Jul '14 19:12
    If this topic has been well covered by us in recent weeks, somebody please cut it off at the pass with a link to the thread.

    In a current Spirituality thread on abortion I have mentioned the instructions for aborting a fetus given in Numbers chapter 5. They are to be carried out when a husband thinks his wife has been unfaithful.

    The procedure involves holy water and temple dust. As far as I am aware, all modern believers-- Jew and Christian-- ignore it.

    How easy is it for you to pick out precisely the commandments you are going to abide by, and which ones it is safe for you to ignore?


    To get things rolling, you might read and comment on this discussion:

    http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/17tbdy/how_do_christians_justify_ignoring_the_old/
  2. SubscriberSuzianne
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    19 Jul '14 19:49
    Originally posted by Paul Dirac II
    If this topic has been well covered by us in recent weeks, somebody please cut it off at the pass with a link to the thread.

    In a current Spirituality thread on abortion I have mentioned the instructions for aborting a fetus given in Numbers chapter 5. They are to be carried out when a husband thinks his wife has been unfaithful.

    The procedure i ...[text shortened]... :

    http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/17tbdy/how_do_christians_justify_ignoring_the_old/
    "I know christians are hypocritical and bend the truth to their will..."

    Really? What ignorance.

    I don't need to read any more of that, thanks.

    And please, let's not go over this *yet again*. Any one who has been in this thread longer than a month knows the answer to this, yet this question keeps coming up, like you guys have the shortest memories ever.
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    19 Jul '14 19:52
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    ...like you guys have the shortest memories ever.
    What was that?
  4. SubscriberSuzianne
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    19 Jul '14 20:14
    Originally posted by C Hess
    What was that?
    Yeah, shorter than my short shorts.
  5. Joined
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    20 Jul '14 01:17
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    And please, let's not go over this *yet again*. Any one who has been in this thread longer than a month knows the answer to this, yet this question keeps coming up, like you guys have the shortest memories ever.
    Link please. Or name of thread.
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    20 Jul '14 01:37
    Originally posted by Paul Dirac II
    If this topic has been well covered by us in recent weeks, somebody please cut it off at the pass with a link to the thread.

    In a current Spirituality thread on abortion I have mentioned the instructions for aborting a fetus given in Numbers chapter 5. They are to be carried out when a husband thinks his wife has been unfaithful.

    The procedure i ...[text shortened]... :

    http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/17tbdy/how_do_christians_justify_ignoring_the_old/
    Paul Dirac,
    Aren't adulterers supposed to be stoned based on God's Old Testament law? What need would there be for abortion? However, thanks for bringing up Numbers 5. If such information is there about abortion, it is worth a read.

    Don't forget though, that Jesus did not require stoning of a woman who committed adultery. Yet, Jesus fulfilled the Law of God.

    King James Version
    ==============
    Matthew 5: 17
    Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

    John 8: 3-11
    And the scribes and Pharisees brought unto him a woman taken in adultery; and when they had set her in the midst,

    They say unto him, Master, this woman was taken in adultery, in the very act.

    Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?

    This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.

    So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her.

    And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.

    And they which heard it, being convicted by their own conscience, went out one by one, beginning at the eldest, even unto the last: and Jesus was left alone, and the woman standing in the midst.

    When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee?

    She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.
  7. Joined
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    20 Jul '14 01:564 edits
    Originally posted by KingOnPoint
    Don't forget though, that Jesus did not require stoning of a woman who committed adultery. Yet, Jesus fulfilled the Law of God.
    The link I gave in the OP quotes Matthew 5:17-18, as you do also:
    Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.

    How do you handle the "until heaven and earth disappear" part of Matthew 5:18?
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    20 Jul '14 02:16
    Originally posted by Paul Dirac II
    If this topic has been well covered by us in recent weeks, somebody please cut it off at the pass with a link to the thread.

    In a current Spirituality thread on abortion I have mentioned the instructions for aborting a fetus given in Numbers chapter 5. They are to be carried out when a husband thinks his wife has been unfaithful.

    The procedure i ...[text shortened]... :

    http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/17tbdy/how_do_christians_justify_ignoring_the_old/
    There are many "commands" the religious ignore. The bread and the wine, "do this in remembrance of me". When you get married, you swear an oath before God, "for better and for worse, for richer and for poorer, until death do us part". Guess they all forgot that when there is an argument (over something stupid) then they get a divorce and remarry again.

    The Holy Spirit inspires Elizabeth to say, "blessed are you among women". And the Holy Spirit inspires Mary, "from this day forward, all nations will call me blessed". About Mary; while the Christians argue over things like when the world was created (R.J.), the fact that these two statements and more about Mary are totally ignored. And that these statements and more are printed in every bible, meaning that these words are also the Word of God.
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    20 Jul '14 02:19
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    "I know christians are hypocritical and bend the truth to their will..."

    Really? What ignorance.

    I don't need to read any more of that, thanks.

    And please, let's not go over this *yet again*. Any one who has been in this thread longer than a month knows the answer to this, yet this question keeps coming up, like you guys have the shortest memories ever.
    Maybe you didn't take the time to read Paul Dirac's first statement. Maybe you should.
  10. Standard memberDeepThought
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    20 Jul '14 02:35
    Originally posted by Pudgenik
    There are many "commands" the religious ignore. The bread and the wine, "do this in remembrance of me". When you get married, you swear an oath before God, "for better and for worse, for richer and for poorer, until death do us part". Guess they all forgot that when there is an argument (over something stupid) then they get a divorce and remarry again.

    ...[text shortened]... atements and more are printed in every bible, meaning that these words are also the Word of God.
    I'm a little surprised by the first paragraph. Most church goers take part in Holy Communion, which is the "do this in remembrance of me" thing. There are plenty of examples of religious people who were married in church and didn't get divorced. Some who do get divorced don't remarry.

    What some alleged Christians do do here, there's a thing in the Gospel according to Mark where the Pharisees are complaining about Jesus doing a miracle on the Sabbeth (as I remember it I don't have a bible to hand), and Jesus asks them: "Was the Sabbeth made for man or man for the Sabbeth?" and some of the pedantry over exact interpretation of the Bible reminds me of that.
  11. Standard memberRJHinds
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    20 Jul '14 04:472 edits
    Originally posted by Pudgenik
    There are many "commands" the religious ignore. The bread and the wine, "do this in remembrance of me". When you get married, you swear an oath before God, "for better and for worse, for richer and for poorer, until death do us part". Guess they all forgot that when there is an argument (over something stupid) then they get a divorce and remarry again.

    ...[text shortened]... atements and more are printed in every bible, meaning that these words are also the Word of God.
    I remember Jesus much more than just when I take bread and wine (grape juice).

    At 70 years of age I have never been divorced nor do I plan to before I die.

    I don't have to be Roman Catholic repeating the Rosary over and over to call Mary blessed. But no one here is challenging the fact that Mary is blessed among women, so I don't need to defend it.

    And if Jesus refers to the beginning of creation as the time God joined man and woman together in marriage, then why shouldn't I defend the faith as to the time of creation not being billions of years ago, but as Jesus said, when God joined man and woman together in marriage?

    Mark 10:6-9 King James Version (KJV)

    But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.


    I don't wish anyone to be deceived by Satan's lies like Eve was. Billions of years is a lie of Satan to reduce your confidence in the power of God. Six days is the truth that shows the mighty power of our God.

    To teach the creation took billions of years is divisive to the faith.
  12. SubscriberSuzianne
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    20 Jul '14 10:15
    Originally posted by Paul Dirac II
    Link please. Or name of thread.
    All of them?
  13. SubscriberSuzianne
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    20 Jul '14 10:31
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    I remember Jesus much more than just when I take bread and wine (grape juice).

    At 70 years of age I have never been divorced nor do I plan to before I die.

    I don't have to be Roman Catholic repeating the Rosary over and over to call Mary blessed. But no one here is challenging the fact that Mary is blessed among women, so I don't need to defend it.

    ...[text shortened]... ty power of our God.

    To teach the creation took billions of years is divisive to the faith.
    Oh, please... "from the beginning of the creation" was just another way of saying "from the beginning" or "since the beginning of time" or any other such "from the start" type openers.

    You literalize this, a comment about "the beginning of creation" which we KNOW was 13 billion years ago, and yet you can sit there with a straight face and say that the things Paul said about Jesus, which happened a mere 2000 years ago, were allegorical. Your priorities are just a little skewed there, Ron.

    I don't need to think God created everything in 6 24-hour days 6000 years ago to have confidence in the mighty power of God. I have all the confidence I need in His mighty power because He did it at all. *Who cares* if it took billions of years? That doesn't take away from God's might.

    You want to know what *is* divisive to the faith? You, trying to blow off the things Paul said about Jesus as only allegorical in nature. Jesus, and His function in our salvation, is a little more important than how long it took to create the universe.
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    20 Jul '14 10:38
    Originally posted by Paul Dirac II
    If this topic has been well covered by us in recent weeks, somebody please cut it off at the pass with a link to the thread.

    In a current Spirituality thread on abortion I have mentioned the instructions for aborting a fetus given in Numbers chapter 5. They are to be carried out when a husband thinks his wife has been unfaithful.

    The procedure i ...[text shortened]... :

    http://www.reddit.com/r/atheism/comments/17tbdy/how_do_christians_justify_ignoring_the_old/
    "How easy is it for you to pick out precisely the commandments you are going to abide by, and which ones it is safe for you to ignore?"

    Be safe. Obey them all. 😲 😉
  15. SubscriberSuzianne
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    20 Jul '14 10:50
    Originally posted by Pudgenik
    There are many "commands" the religious ignore. The bread and the wine, "do this in remembrance of me". When you get married, you swear an oath before God, "for better and for worse, for richer and for poorer, until death do us part". Guess they all forgot that when there is an argument (over something stupid) then they get a divorce and remarry again.

    ...[text shortened]... atements and more are printed in every bible, meaning that these words are also the Word of God.
    Maybe you need to go to his link and see exactly what he is asking us believers to comment on.

    It is an atheist message forum. I don't know about you, but I have no comment on that. Not that could be printed here. Many there are also talking about the same subject in their ignorance. "Why do believers not follow ALL of the law?" or some such nonsense as this.

    I ask them why do you not remember the LAST 40 times you asked us this and what we said then? As I recall the last time this was discussed was just this last week. Sonhouse brings this up periodically, about "how stupid" the laws in Exodus, Deuteronomy, and Numbers are today and how this MUST mean that all religions, Christianity included, is a fabrication of man.


    Your instances are rather specific and probably not the best examples. I take Eucharist every Sunday, so not ignoring that one. I've never been married. Engaged a couple of times and each time I called it off before a divorce was necessary, so not ignoring that one, either. I've often posted about Elizabeth and Mary and so not ignoring those, either. So I'm not seeing all these commands you say are being ignored. The ones I see being most ignored are simple ones, like loving your neighbor as yourself and also to love your Christian brothers ( <- this one especially).
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