Originally posted by avalanchethecat This is exactly the sort of arrogance that makes Christianity so unpalatable to me - why don't they just have gang colours and be done with it.
Any particular external authority you do happen to accept?
Originally posted by Grampy Bobby Simply provided a straightforward and direct answer to karoly aczel's question. The created universe and absolute truth existed
before our arrival on the scene and will still be firmly in place after our departure. Our challenge is to apprehend it while here.
Well this account of a fixed and immutable universe, there before us and long after us, rather fails to describe what we now know about the universe. It changes greatly and is largely chaotic. The apparent stability of things relies on our human perspective and is trivial. Lets see if humans can mange the hundreds of millions of years achieved by the Dinosaurs before it's time for our great extinction. Signs are not good. Humans appear likely to be a very brief splash ( a plop) in the waters of history.
Originally posted by buckky It came to me today that the Christian must think that the non Christian is just not thinking right, or they would become Christian. Is it a matter of not understanding, or is it a matter of being too dumb to get it, or is it just plain evil on the part of the non believer ? Sometimes the road block that comes when we discuss these matters seems to come down ...[text shortened]... convince the other side as to why they are not looking at it correctly. See it my way or Burn .
consider this, and then i will go away...
the words Jesus spoke were in the language of aramaic...
when the original aramaic is read the translations of scholars past are quite suspect...
sorta like,
someone were hovering over them with a whip...
learn the original...
listen to the words with new ears...
Originally posted by buckky It came to me today that the Christian must think that the non Christian is just not thinking right, or they would become Christian. Is it a matter of not understanding, or is it a matter of being too dumb to get it, or is it just plain evil on the part of the non believer ? Sometimes the road block that comes when we discuss these matters seems to come down ...[text shortened]... convince the other side as to why they are not looking at it correctly. See it my way or Burn .
You can say the opposite. You could say that atheists think that those of faith are not "thinking right". In fact, they are more likely to take the road of arrogance and assume it is because those of faith simply are not smart enough to see the truth of the matter. They then smugly point to science as if this somehow disproves everything they believe. Also, if science can't validate what they believe then atheists think that those of faith must all be daft.
Originally posted by Grampy Bobby Simply provided a straightforward and direct answer to karoly aczel's question. The created universe and absolute truth existed
before our arrival on the scene and will still be firmly in place after our departure. Our challenge is to apprehend it while here.
A direct answer would have been "yes" or "no", not a biblical quote.
Originally posted by whodey You can say the opposite. You could say that atheists think that those of faith are not "thinking right". In fact, they are more likely to take the road of arrogance and assume it is because those of faith simply are not smart enough to see the truth of the matter. They then smugly point to science as if this somehow disproves everything they believe. Als ...[text shortened]... ce can't validate what they believe then atheists think that those of faith must all be daft.
I'd say the daftness is in adopting a particular holy book as truth over all others (that have or have yet to be proposed), especially given it's age and the propensity of humans to fill the gaps in their knowledge with superstition and a desire for their lives to have some 'greater purpose'.
I along with many others don't equate folly with lack of intellect.
Originally posted by Agerg I'd say the daftness is in adopting a particular holy book as truth over all others (that have or have yet to be proposed), especially given it's age and the propensity of humans to fill the gaps in their knowledge with superstition and a desire for their lives to have some 'greater purpose'.
I along with many others don't equate folly with lack of intellect.
Well assuming there is a God, then the question is, does this God want to be known? If God wants to be known, which holy texts are illustrative of him? Of course, they can't all be 100% correct because of their various differences. I suppose you could say that God revealed himself a little here and a little there but not in any one text. If so, does such a God really want to be known? It seems to me that such a God is a God of confusion.
But if God does not want to be known, then attempts at knowing anything about him if he exists is pointless.
Originally posted by whodey Well assuming there is a God, then the question is, does this God want to be known? If God wants to be known, which holy texts are illustrative of him? Of course, they can't all be 100% correct because of their various differences. I suppose you could say that God revealed himself a little here and a little there but not in any one text. If so, does such ...[text shortened]... s not want to be known, then attempts at knowing anything about him if he exists is pointless.
I think "God" wants to be known. I just think the way in which we a trying to get to know Her is wrong. Once we get on the right track we can start moving forward.
There are many ways in which we may start this process. A part of that is understanding that God is not a separate entitiy,(from the rest of creation, including the idea/concept of the entity that many have called the devil).
Originally posted by whodey I suppose you could say that God revealed himself a little here and a little there but not in any one text. If so, does such a God really want to be known? It seems to me that such a God is a God of confusion.
I would say the same about the God of the Bible if he exists. He seems to reveal himself a little here and there to different Christians in different ways making different and contradictory claims about himself. Its so bad that in the Little town of Livingstone where I come from population approx 100,000, there are over 150 Christian denominations. Apparently each group read something different in their Bible that was so different from what everybody else read that they feel it necessary to differentiate themselves from everyone else and not worship with them.
Originally posted by twhitehead I would say the same about the God of the Bible if he exists. He seems to reveal himself a little here and there to different Christians in different ways making different and contradictory claims about himself. Its so bad that in the Little town of Livingstone where I come from population approx 100,000, there are over 150 Christian denominations. Appare ...[text shortened]... they feel it necessary to differentiate themselves from everyone else and not worship with them.
Agreed.
Such a shame that different religous groups cant focus on the similarities of their faith rather thanegotistially pointing out the differences in a bid to appear right. Not only different religons but eventhe different denominations within the thesame faith.
After all these christians claim to believe in one god. Following the logical conclusions of this assertion it would follow that someone must be wrong with their claims. I dont hear many christians willing to admit that they are eve partially wrong , let alone that they may be completely wrong tith their assertions.
Originally posted by karoly aczel I think "God" wants to be known. I just think the way in which we a trying to get to know Her is wrong. Once we get on the right track we can start moving forward.
There are many ways in which we may start this process. A part of that is understanding that God is not a separate entitiy,(from the rest of creation, including the idea/concept of the entity that many have called the devil).
My point here is that if God wants to be known there apparently is a disconnect that has initiated him wanting to be known. According to you this disconnect stems from thinking that God is a seperate entity. In that case, then God has a disconnect with himself/herself. Perhaps we can begin medicating ourselves in order to fix ourselves?
Originally posted by twhitehead I would say the same about the God of the Bible if he exists. He seems to reveal himself a little here and there to different Christians in different ways making different and contradictory claims about himself. Its so bad that in the Little town of Livingstone where I come from population approx 100,000, there are over 150 Christian denominations. Appare ...[text shortened]... they feel it necessary to differentiate themselves from everyone else and not worship with them.
That is one way of looking at it, however, another way of looking at it is that three major world religions point to the God of the Bible. In fact, the majority are either Christian or Islamic. So if God is being given some other way, then perhaps God's methods are not working so well.
Having said that, it would frighten me if everyone agreed about everything they believed about God. After all, is he 100% knowable? How can a finite being completly comprehend an infinite being? I say you can't. It seems to me that if God wants to be known, he would provide us with building blocks from which to work from rather than being 100% in agreement about everything.
So what are the building blocks? It seems to me that Christ is the building block for Christians and Mohammad is the building block for Islam. The reason being is that Christians do not question any of the teachings of Christ just as those in Islam do not question any of the teachings of Mohammad.
18 May '10 19:14
Not thinking right
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