21 Jan '12 10:14>1 edit
Perhaps this thread should have been posted in the Debates Forum, but I want to specifically apply it to Spirituality debates.
I don't often take part in Sp Debates anymore, because of the illogicality of many, if not most, of the posts. There is often nothing that can be said that would add any value, because we are not having a debate, but merely making dogmatic statements.
IMHO, the biggest barrier to any sensible debate is the confusion between OPINIONS and FACTS.
Of course, both FACTS and OPINIONS are valid subjects for debate, but the rules for them are quite different. Opinions should be based on facts, and their interpretation. Facts can be checked. And anybody's opinion (if logically based) can be equally valid, since they are subjective. The object of a debate would be to prove to you that my opinion is more valid than yours.
For example, the perennial debate about evolution constantly confuses opinions and facts.
"Most Christians believe in a Young Earth Chreation". OPINION: such a survey was never done, and there are many Christians that don't believe this.
"Such-and-such a religion is true!" is also an OPINION, because many demonstrably hold that this is not so.
However, "The Vedic religion teaches such-and-such" is a FACT, that can be checked (as some have done). But to say that it is true, is an opinion.
Another example: The Trinitarian debate between JWs and others is based on certain texts in scriptures. With very few exceptions, participants in this debate accept the scriptures, but interpret them differently. The fact that the SAME scriptures can be interpreted in various ways, is demonstrated by the plethora of denominations! Again, IMHO this is a valid subject for debate and we can continue to try to convince others of our own position, as long as one does not descend into vilification and insults.
I would be very willing to participate in posts from Dasa if he were to prefix them with: "I believe that.......", or "In my opinion......". or even "In my exerience...." Then one could get somewhere with a common basis of facts.
He could even convince someone of the validity of his opinions, and that a Vedic society would be an improvement on the present one.
But there is nothing anybody can say, and no room for sensible arguments, if a debate is started: "This is the truth, and everybody who says otherwise is a liar..."
It would be really great if it could be a common ground rule to all Spirituality debates that we distinguish between what is a FACT and what is merely my OPINION.
But then it would also be great if money grew on the tree in my back yard......
Both equally unlikely!
😉
I don't often take part in Sp Debates anymore, because of the illogicality of many, if not most, of the posts. There is often nothing that can be said that would add any value, because we are not having a debate, but merely making dogmatic statements.
IMHO, the biggest barrier to any sensible debate is the confusion between OPINIONS and FACTS.
Of course, both FACTS and OPINIONS are valid subjects for debate, but the rules for them are quite different. Opinions should be based on facts, and their interpretation. Facts can be checked. And anybody's opinion (if logically based) can be equally valid, since they are subjective. The object of a debate would be to prove to you that my opinion is more valid than yours.
For example, the perennial debate about evolution constantly confuses opinions and facts.
"Most Christians believe in a Young Earth Chreation". OPINION: such a survey was never done, and there are many Christians that don't believe this.
"Such-and-such a religion is true!" is also an OPINION, because many demonstrably hold that this is not so.
However, "The Vedic religion teaches such-and-such" is a FACT, that can be checked (as some have done). But to say that it is true, is an opinion.
Another example: The Trinitarian debate between JWs and others is based on certain texts in scriptures. With very few exceptions, participants in this debate accept the scriptures, but interpret them differently. The fact that the SAME scriptures can be interpreted in various ways, is demonstrated by the plethora of denominations! Again, IMHO this is a valid subject for debate and we can continue to try to convince others of our own position, as long as one does not descend into vilification and insults.
I would be very willing to participate in posts from Dasa if he were to prefix them with: "I believe that.......", or "In my opinion......". or even "In my exerience...." Then one could get somewhere with a common basis of facts.
He could even convince someone of the validity of his opinions, and that a Vedic society would be an improvement on the present one.
But there is nothing anybody can say, and no room for sensible arguments, if a debate is started: "This is the truth, and everybody who says otherwise is a liar..."
It would be really great if it could be a common ground rule to all Spirituality debates that we distinguish between what is a FACT and what is merely my OPINION.
But then it would also be great if money grew on the tree in my back yard......
Both equally unlikely!
😉