1. Joined
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    23 Apr '12 15:10
    i might be being a bit slow here as this has just dawned on me, is original sin all about sex. was the fruit a metaphor for humping?

    i vaguely remember phillip pullman talking about original sin and sex in the 3rd part of his dark materials trilogy. i read it about 15 years ago and didnt really think about it. is sex the sin that god didnt want doing? is that why jesus was an immaculate conception, is that why jesus didnt do it, is that why lots of priest pretend they dont do it, is that why nuns dont do it?
  2. Standard memberSwissGambit
    Caninus Interruptus
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    23 Apr '12 15:52
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    i might be being a bit slow here as this has just dawned on me, is original sin all about sex. was the fruit a metaphor for humping?

    i vaguely remember phillip pullman talking about original sin and sex in the 3rd part of his dark materials trilogy. i read it about 15 years ago and didnt really think about it. is sex the sin that god didnt want doing ...[text shortened]... us didnt do it, is that why lots of priest pretend they dont do it, is that why nuns dont do it?
    I thought married people humping was OK according to the Bible. 😛
  3. Standard memberRJHinds
    The Near Genius
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    23 Apr '12 16:20
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    i might be being a bit slow here as this has just dawned on me, is original sin all about sex. was the fruit a metaphor for humping?

    i vaguely remember phillip pullman talking about original sin and sex in the 3rd part of his dark materials trilogy. i read it about 15 years ago and didnt really think about it. is sex the sin that god didnt want doing ...[text shortened]... us didnt do it, is that why lots of priest pretend they dont do it, is that why nuns dont do it?
    NO! God created male and female and commanded them to reproduce
    after their kind. Orignal sin was not believing GOD. So now we can repent and
    believe in God through His Son. Remember Christ said, "No one comes to the
    Father but through ME." HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord!
  4. Joined
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    23 Apr '12 16:36
    The tribes who invented the monotheistic religions of Judaism, Christianity, and Islam had a rather
    prudish and infantile view of sexuality which is and has been the source of an awful lot of prejudice
    and suffering over the years and is still an issue today.
  5. Standard memberRJHinds
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    23 Apr '12 16:44
    Originally posted by googlefudge
    The tribes who invented the monotheistic religions of Judaism, Christianity, and Islam had a rather
    prudish and infantile view of sexuality which is and has been the source of an awful lot of prejudice
    and suffering over the years and is still an issue today.
    That is because it is a gift from God and should be used wisely. HalleluYah !!!
  6. Joined
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    23 Apr '12 16:45
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    i might be being a bit slow here as this has just dawned on me, is original sin all about sex. was the fruit a metaphor for humping?

    i vaguely remember phillip pullman talking about original sin and sex in the 3rd part of his dark materials trilogy. i read it about 15 years ago and didnt really think about it. is sex the sin that god didnt want doing ...[text shortened]... us didnt do it, is that why lots of priest pretend they dont do it, is that why nuns dont do it?
    The forbidden fruit rule was symbolic of man-made rules that are, or at least seem, arbitrary. The Eden story tells of that tragic time when humans become aware that we have to control our natural individualistic instincts and obey man-made rules in order to have the benefits of living in a social group. Mankind as a whole, and each of us as persons, goes through that. Among those rules are the circumstances under which you are allowed to make whoopee. It is/was especially bad to break the rules about reproduction. Not so much about sex; but back in the day, sex meant reproduction way more than it does now.

    That's the Fall.

    The Atonement aspect of it is another story.
  7. Joined
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    23 Apr '12 16:45
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    That is because it is a gift from God and should be used wisely. HalleluYah !!!
    No it's because they were prudish control freaks who thought that women were property.

    Which is still the problem with the fundamentalists of all three Abrahamic religions today.
  8. Joined
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    23 Apr '12 17:25
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    [b]NO! God created male and female and commanded them to reproduce
    after their kind. Orignal sin was not believing GOD. So now we can repent and
    believe in God through His Son. Remember Christ said, "No one comes to the
    Father but through ME." HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord![/b]
    so were adam and eve married? how long were they single for? who married them?
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    23 Apr '12 17:491 edit
    would i be right in saying adam and eve had no children whilst in the garden? so either they didnt have sex or they couldnt reproduce. would i be right in saying they had eternal life in the garden and lost it when they left. maybe that was the deal, you can only have reproduction or eternal life and not both. the fruit is also spoken of as 'knowledge' maybe this was the 'knowledge' of how to reproduce. maybe god was angry because until that point creation was his thing and by adam and eve wanting to create they were attempting to be god like. that is why we can only go back to god at the end of time when there will be no more births or deaths. effectively when we have given up our creation knowledge. its not the f*ng god hates its the reproduction!!!
  10. Subscribersonhouse
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    23 Apr '12 17:57
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    That is because it is a gift from God and should be used wisely. HalleluYah !!!
    Using sex wisely. Now there is an oxymoron if I ever heard one.
  11. Account suspended
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    23 Apr '12 18:01
    Originally posted by JS357
    The forbidden fruit rule was symbolic of man-made rules that are, or at least seem, arbitrary. The Eden story tells of that tragic time when humans become aware that we have to control our natural individualistic instincts and obey man-made rules in order to have the benefits of living in a social group. Mankind as a whole, and each of us as persons, go ...[text shortened]... way more than it does now.

    That's the Fall.

    The Atonement aspect of it is another story.
    not quite, the forbidden fruit represented Gods universal sovereignty, that is, whether
    God has the right to decree what is morally just. The original sin was a bid for moral
    independence from God, which included the lie, that moral independence from God was
    both desirable and beneficial for mankind, now thoroughly refuted.
  12. Joined
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    23 Apr '12 18:05
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    not quite, the forbidden fruit represented Gods universal sovereignty, that is, whether
    God has the right to decree what is morally just. The original sin was a bid for moral
    independence from God, which included the lie, that moral independence from God was
    both desirable and beneficial for mankind, now thoroughly refuted.
    as god created the human brain, it would be impossible to do anything he had not already thought of or created the brain to think. unless you think the human brain 'evolved' on it own.
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    23 Apr '12 18:111 edit
    Originally posted by stellspalfie
    as god created the human brain, it would be impossible to do anything he had not already thought of or created the brain to think. unless you think the human brain 'evolved' on it own.
    no, they were not auto bots, but reasoning and highly intelligent individuals with the
    capacity to exercise the faculty of conscience. Indeed, if you look at the account, the
    term 'and the fruit was desirable to look upon' Genesis 3:6, literally means, it was good
    "to impart wisdom (intelligence; prudence)" thus what you have from the satanic
    agency is a direct attempt to appeal to Eves intellect.

    The argument that God could have foreseen the rebellion and prevented it is a
    particularity weak one, for of course he could, but it would not have settled the issue of
    Gods universal sovereignty, that is, whether Gods rule really is beneficial for mankind
    or whether mankind really is better off independent from God.
  14. Joined
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    23 Apr '12 18:23
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    not quite, the forbidden fruit represented Gods universal sovereignty, that is, whether
    God has the right to decree what is morally just. The original sin was a bid for moral
    independence from God, which included the lie, that moral independence from God was
    both desirable and beneficial for mankind, now thoroughly refuted.
    With all due respect, I am telling my story, not anyone else's, except by coincidence. I would say that "God" in the story you relate, is "the group" or "the greater good" in mine. In your last sentence, the greater good and mankind become synonymous, which is cool by me.

    The "universal sovereignty" of mankind, and equivalently of God, is in the broadest sense, that which individual autonomy rebels against, so I can accept "God" as quite a good poetic metaphor. (There are points at which the analogy between "mankind" and "god" breaks down, as all analogies do if pushed too far.)

    The reason that the violation is called original sin and is thought to be something in-born, is that individual autonomy is the most basic natural point of view, from which we see what is good and what is evil. We must be able to think from the point of view of mankind, if we are to get along as part of mankind instead of living by rules that work only in the wild. The story we are discussing is all about this, in its God metaphor. It concerns the time when we moved from living in the wild, to living in the tribe. This was the enshrinement of morality.
  15. Joined
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    23 Apr '12 18:38
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    no, they were not auto bots, but reasoning and highly intelligent individuals with the
    capacity to exercise the faculty of conscience. Indeed, if you look at the account, the
    term 'and the fruit was desirable to look upon' Genesis 3:6, literally means, it was good
    "to impart wisdom (intelligence; prudence)" thus what you have from the satanic ...[text shortened]... ly is beneficial for mankind
    or whether mankind really is better off independent from God.
    a dog is not an auto bot but it is only capable of thinking things that its dogs brain will allow it. you can only think something that the brain is designed to allow you to think. if you were given the freedom to do anything you could think of. you would just think of normal stuff nothing new would spring into your head that no human has ever come close to thinking because you are confined to the brain and what it will let you think.
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