1. Joined
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    23 Mar '14 14:11
    Someone may think that paradoxes exist. But God is one, and has one way to heaven. It isn't through being good enough, and it isn't through killing yourself.

    The bible tells that Christ Himself is the Savior.

    King James Version
    ==============
    John 3: 16
    For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

    John 14: 6
    Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
  2. Standard memberSwissGambit
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    23 Mar '14 16:41
    Originally posted by KingOnPoint
    But God is one, and has one way to heaven. It isn't through being good enough, and it isn't through killing yourself.
    Who says that killing yourself is the way to heaven? That's a new one. 😛
  3. Standard membersonshiponline
    the corrected one.
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    23 Mar '14 21:04
    Originally posted by KingOnPoint
    Someone may think that paradoxes exist. But God is one, and has one way to heaven. It isn't through being good enough, and it isn't through killing yourself.

    The bible tells that Christ Himself is the Savior.

    King James Version
    ==============
    John 3: 16
    For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in ...[text shortened]... saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
    Yes, I believe there are some paradoxes.

    John 3:13 - "No one has ascended into heaven, but He who descended out of heaven, the Son of Man, who is in heaven."

    Where is He ?
  4. Joined
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    23 Mar '14 22:44
    Originally posted by sonship
    Yes, I believe there are some paradoxes.

    [b]John 3:13 - "No one has ascended into heaven, but He who descended out of heaven, the Son of Man, who is in heaven."


    Where is He ?[/b]
    The only one who ascended into heaven was someone who descended from it. He was back in heaven at the time of the writing of John, according to the writer of John. There have been no reliable reported developments as to his whereabouts at present. However, some identify him with the omnipresent deity, in which cause he is everywhere he can be.
  5. Standard membersonshiponline
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    23 Mar '14 23:451 edit
    Originally posted by JS357
    The only one who ascended into heaven was someone who descended from it. He was back in heaven at the time of the writing of John, according to the writer of John. There have been no reliable reported developments as to his whereabouts at present. However, some identify him with the omnipresent deity, in which cause he is everywhere he can be.
    That was thoughtful. What I meant was, at the time Jesus spoke those words, it is kind of a paradox as to from where He was speaking.

    Thanks.

    We know that now He is at the right hand of God (Rom. 8:34) and in the believers (Rom. 8:10).
  6. Joined
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    24 Mar '14 05:50
    Originally posted by sonship
    That was thoughtful. What I meant was, at the time Jesus spoke those words, it is kind of a paradox as to from where He was speaking.

    Thanks.

    We know that now He is at the right hand of God [b](Rom. 8:34)
    and in the believers (Rom. 8:10).[/b]
    Well, if he is in some real sense identifiable as the omnipresent god, is he also to god's left? (The sense of all this seems to challenge and defeat human comprehension.)
  7. Joined
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    24 Mar '14 08:12
    If you hold the bible as the truth, there are a lot of paradoxes in the bible.

    If there are two statements in the bible that are mutual exclusive, if one is true, then the other cannot be true, and vice versa, and at the same time the bible is true, then you have a paradox.

    And there are a lot of them. Christianity is a paradox per se.
  8. Joined
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    25 Mar '14 15:09
    SwissGambit,
    Is it true that that the surest way for a Muslim to enter "heaven' is for the Muslim to kill himself in a Jihad? Are Muslim women allowed to kill themselves for the same purpose?
  9. Joined
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    25 Mar '14 15:10
    Sonship,
    Are Christians that have died humanly in heaven now? Are they in Paradise?
  10. Standard membersonshiponline
    the corrected one.
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    25 Mar '14 15:141 edit
    Originally posted by KingOnPoint
    Sonship,
    Are Christians that have died humanly in heaven now? Are they in Paradise?
    The departed saints are now in Paradise.
    And our eternal destiny is not in heaven.

    The New Testament salvation is spoken more in terms of going to a Person rather than going to a place.
  11. Standard memberSwissGambit
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    25 Mar '14 15:14
    Originally posted by KingOnPoint
    SwissGambit,
    Is it true that that the surest way for a Muslim to enter "heaven' is for the Muslim to kill himself in a Jihad? Are Muslim women allowed to kill themselves for the same purpose?
    A "Jihad" sounds like dying in battle.

    I can't help but wonder if all the rumors of martyrs being promised 72 virgins in heaven for suicide bombings are greatly exaggerated by the west. After all, we'd much rather hear a reason like that, instead of 'the situation in their country sucks so much that they are this desperate to effect change.'
  12. Joined
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    25 Mar '14 15:14
    Fabian,
    Don't expect that God has the same point of view as you and I. God is omnipotent, omniscient, and omnipresent. However, would you please list the first paradox in the bible as you see it?
  13. Joined
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    25 Mar '14 15:16
    Sonship,
    If christians are only in paradise, then there is no paradox for Christ ascending into heaven without Saints.
  14. Joined
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    25 Mar '14 15:28
    SwissGambit,
    One problem with that, perhaps, since I have not read all of the Qur'an, is that Christ said that there is no human man and woman marriage in heaven, neither giving in marriage.

    King James Version
    ==============
    Matthew 22: 30
    For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
  15. Joined
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    25 Mar '14 15:30
    SwissGambit,
    Also, if I am not wrong, Muslims who kill themselves in Jihad are not promised, "heaven" even then. They may still have to be good enough to be in "heaven."
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