1. Joined
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    05 Apr '14 14:42
    To what extent does prophesy change our future?

    I ask this to both believers and nonbelievers. As a person of faith, I submit that foretelling the future changes the future. I believe that prophesy is a process of manipulating the future as well as predicting it.
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    05 Apr '14 14:54
    Certainly self fulfilling prophecies exist, making a prophecy that an event will
    occur can indeed change the probability that it will happen.

    Both ways.
    If we predict that our present actions will lead to an undesirable future that
    may well cause us to change our actions and avoid that future.
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    05 Apr '14 20:49
    Originally posted by googlefudge
    Certainly self fulfilling prophecies exist, making a prophecy that an event will
    occur can indeed change the probability that it will happen.

    Both ways.
    If we predict that our present actions will lead to an undesirable future that
    may well cause us to change our actions and avoid that future.
    One prophesy in particular comes to mind. The mark of the beast is a prophesy that the state will "mark" people or they will be unable to buy or sell.

    Looking at todays technology, it is now possible for this to happen. Microchips can be implanted, and have been, that have the capacity to be used for monetary purposes.

    Do you think that the prophesy enabled the technology to make this a reality? I don't. However, I would say that those who will advocate for this type of technology in the future will have this prophesy as an obstacle to make it a reality. I would even go far as to say that we may have already have this a reality had it not been for the prophesy.

    Really, the only way to make the mark a reality is to destroy the belief in Revelation, probably at the expense of the Christian faith. Therefore, a war on the Christian faith would probably be the best way for people to comply with the mark.
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    05 Apr '14 22:14
    Originally posted by whodey
    One prophesy in particular comes to mind. The mark of the beast is a prophesy that the state will "mark" people or they will be unable to buy or sell.

    Looking at todays technology, it is now possible for this to happen. Microchips can be implanted, and have been, that have the capacity to be used for monetary purposes.

    Do you think that the prophesy e ...[text shortened]... a war on the Christian faith would probably be the best way for people to comply with the mark.
    One prophesy in particular comes to mind. The mark of the beast is a prophesy that the state will "mark" people or they will be unable to buy or sell.


    Any particular state? If Lichtenstein does this will that be enough? Or does it have to be the whole world? I don't think many states would try to enforce this. Much less draconian to use a biometric that we already have, like an iris scan.

    Penguin
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    05 Apr '14 22:17
    Originally posted by whodey
    One prophesy in particular comes to mind. The mark of the beast is a prophesy that the state will "mark" people or they will be unable to buy or sell.

    Looking at todays technology, it is now possible for this to happen. Microchips can be implanted, and have been, that have the capacity to be used for monetary purposes.

    Do you think that the prophesy e ...[text shortened]... a war on the Christian faith would probably be the best way for people to comply with the mark.
    The prophecy is way way way to vague.

    There are a myriad of ways that you can, and people have, interpreted the
    'prophecies' in the bible which make them effectively useless and meaningless.
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    06 Apr '14 08:07
    Originally posted by whodey
    Looking at todays technology, it is now possible for this to happen. Microchips can be implanted, and have been, that have the capacity to be used for monetary purposes.
    Why must it be implanted? What difference does it really make if the mark is implanted rather than merely on you at all times?
    You have already been marked with a device capable of recognizing you, using it for monetary transactions and following your every move. Its called a cell phone.
  7. Cape Town
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    06 Apr '14 08:09
    Originally posted by whodey
    However, I would say that those who will advocate for this type of technology in the future will have this prophesy as an obstacle to make it a reality.
    Only in small countries like the US. I am sure that most people in China and India don't care what your prophesies have to say. As for North Korea, they wouldn't even ask the people what they thought about prophesies, they would just do it.
  8. SubscriberSuzianne
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    06 Apr '14 13:16
    Originally posted by whodey
    To what extent does prophesy change our future?

    I ask this to both believers and nonbelievers. As a person of faith, I submit that foretelling the future changes the future. I believe that prophesy is a process of manipulating the future as well as predicting it.
    Prophecy changes nothing.

    Man usually walks headlong directly into prophetic times without changing and without blinking an eye. This is another message of the Bible. Time and again it happened, especially in the OT.
  9. SubscriberSuzianne
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    06 Apr '14 13:24
    Originally posted by whodey
    Really, the only way to make the mark a reality is to destroy the belief in Revelation, probably at the expense of the Christian faith. Therefore, a war on the Christian faith would probably be the best way for people to comply with the mark.
    Wow, really whodey? I've only been saying this here and elsewhere for years now. "Crying out in the wilderness", indeed. 😛

    Oh, btw, just an "FYI": the noun is "prophecy", the verb is "prophesy".
  10. SubscriberSuzianne
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    06 Apr '14 13:31
    Originally posted by whodey
    I would even go far as to say that we may have already have this a reality had it not been for the prophesy.
    I agree with this much, though.

    We've already accepted microchips in our animals. There has not been widespread chipping of humans precisely because people would not stand for it because of this prophecy.

    http://www.spychips.com/
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    06 Apr '14 13:451 edit
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    I agree with this much, though.

    We've already accepted microchips in our animals. There has not been widespread chipping of humans precisely because people would not stand for it because of this prophecy.

    http://www.spychips.com/
    I think the mark of the beast may be something more visible by those around you, sort of like the nazis did with the Jews and the Star of David sewn into their clothes. Perhaps a type of tattoo on the head or hand. By having something visible to others or nothing at all would subject you to ridicule or worse by others if they saw you were opposed, a sort of pressure.

    Personally to focus on this is to take are eyes off of God.
  12. SubscriberSuzianne
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    06 Apr '14 13:52
    Originally posted by yoctobyte
    Personally to focus on this is to take are eyes off of God.
    Really?

    Would YOU take the "mark"?
  13. SubscriberSuzianne
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    06 Apr '14 13:551 edit
    Originally posted by Penguin
    One prophesy in particular comes to mind. The mark of the beast is a prophesy that the state will "mark" people or they will be unable to buy or sell.


    Any particular state? If Lichtenstein does this will that be enough? Or does it have to be the whole world? I don't think many states would try to enforce this. Much less draconian to use a biometric that we already have, like an iris scan.

    Penguin
    An iris-scan does not "mark" the forehead or the right hand.

    When the mark comes, it will be world-wide under the rule of the AntiChrist.

    The mark is foretold to be a mark of ownership, showing that one belongs to the AntiChrist.

    Another reason why it has not happened yet. It's not yet time.
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    06 Apr '14 16:362 edits
    Originally posted by Penguin
    One prophesy in particular comes to mind. The mark of the beast is a prophesy that the state will "mark" people or they will be unable to buy or sell.


    Any particular state? If Lichtenstein does this will that be enough? Or does it have to be the whole world? I don't think many states would try to enforce this. Much less draconian to use a biometric that we already have, like an iris scan.

    Penguin
    Right now no. However, if you look at the economic landscape you will see economic disaster at some point. It could happen at the twinkling of an eye at any time.

    With out of control spending in the West it is only a matter of time before the house of cards comes tumbling down, and when it does, the same people who carefully manufactured the crisis will be there to "pick up the pieces". My guess is that an international organization like the IMF will be instrumental in "fixing" the world's economies. It will be a step towards a one world order where economics becomes the link between nations as nations of the world gradually surrender their sovereignty in the name of economic livelihood.

    And think of all the "benefits" such a system would have.

    1. No more cheating on taxes. If every financial transaction is by computer it can all be traced rather easily.
    2. No more missing persons. With a GPS attached no more running from the law and no more trying to locate missing persons for whatever reason. After all, why would anyone wish to be able to run from the law unless they have something to hide? A few more terrorist attacks and people will be lining up to have this implanted for their safety and the safety of society.
    3. Health care will demand a chip implanted at some point. The trillions that can be saved is plain to see. No more having to take a history when entering a hospital and those unable to give a history will simply have their chip scanned and they will know everything about them. Not only money will be saved, lives will be saved. Again, people will be lining up in droves for the mark for this reason alone.

    And all who will be left are religious fanatics like myself who refuse to take the mark based upon some ancient obscure prophesy. People like me will be marginalized and demonized as an enemy of society because I reject the method for keeping people safe and secure and economically viable.
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    06 Apr '14 16:39
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    Really?

    Would YOU take the "mark"?
    No of course not, not knowingly.

    I read a piece awhile back regarding the mark that makes some sense. The writer indicated that the 'mark' may be some form of tattoo that is unique to the individual. For instance in the case of faith... a Jew may choose the Star of David, a hindu may choose... well there are hundreds of symbols for their religion, a Christian may unwittingly choose a cross, an atheist may choose their favorite sports team. The point is, the mark may 'special or unique' to the wearer and necessary to be visible by all, by doing so... all would know if somebody has not taken the mark. I think aside from not being able to buy, sell, etc. people would categorize you much in the same way the Jews were in Nazi Germany as being a scourge on society.

    Society would be against you, not only the buying and selling component. Just my opinion.

    I read your link a few posts back, an issue that would certainly come up is the effect of RFID on the body, does it cause cancer? This alone would be problematic in getting people to go along with implanting a device of this type. Perhaps it could be a QR code that is linked to a database somewhere, there are many possibilities.

    For me anyhow, I am not that certain it would be RFID or some other type of electronic device. Vs trying to figure out the mark we keep or eyes on God.
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