@fmf saidI was on strike as a member of a labor union many years ago, it had little to do with "moral issues" The company was firing and/or laying off workers who had been there for years for no good reason, so they didn't have to honor the pension agreements they signed off on at the last bargaining session. The union finally took the company to court, won the lawsuit and the workers were ordered reinstated. This was back in the days before "organized labor" became dirty words and akin to un-American socialism. A few years later, the ruling was overturned on appeal by a conservative judge and the firings renewed until finally the company (who had stashed the bulk of their cash holdings in an offshore shell corporation) cried poor mouth, and used the bankruptcy laws to break the union, as a result, everyone was fired in favor of low wage scab labor, with pension and healthcare benefits just a fading memory. End result: The top tier execs at the company got filthy rich, and those who could least afford it (and their families) got the privilege of looking for another job during a recession.
What are the moral issues surrounding going on strike and other kinds of action and protest in the midst of disputes?
It's possible there is a moral "issue" here somewhere, but all I remember afterward was having to live in my car for 4 months until I found another job and could afford to rent a cheap apartment.
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18 Feb 22
@mchill saidThere’s a mass of stuff in here.
I was on strike as a member of a labor union many years ago, it had little to do with "moral issues" The company was firing and/or laying off workers who had been there for years for no good reason, so they didn't have to honor the pension agreements they signed off on at the last bargaining session. The union finally took the company to court, won the lawsuit and the workers ...[text shortened]... to live in my car for 4 months until I found another job and could afford to rent a cheap apartment.
“Scab Labour” what’s that? Workers who are prepared to go to work for less money than the local employees? Over here this dynamic was one of the triggers of the Brexit movement. Cheap foreign labour being brought in to keep inflation low triggered blow back from the workforces in various locations in the uk.
You can either have freedom of movement of labour, or you can have higher paid “protected” jobs with less employment competitiveness. It’s a dynamic phenomenon of course, but fundamentally you can’t have both. Or at least it’s a very fine balance which is hard to achieve.
@divegeester saidYou can either have freedom of movement of labour, or you can have higher paid “protected” jobs with less employment competitiveness.
There’s a mass of stuff in here.
“Scab Labour” what’s that? Workers who are prepared to go to work for less money than the local employees? Over here this dynamic was one of the triggers of the Brexit movement. Cheap foreign labour being brought in to keep inflation low triggered blow back from the workforces in various locations in the uk.
You can either have free ...[text shortened]... ut fundamentally you can’t have both. Or at least it’s a very fine balance which is hard to achieve.
It's so convenient to debate the details of this sitting at our computers, but if you were one of those hundreds of laid off workers forced to live on the streets, and in your cars, bankrupt and hungry, while the fat cat company execs got rich off your misery, you might just see things differently. But maybe you're right, maybe we should all work for $10.00 a day and no toilet breaks, while a very few at the top rake in the bulk of the wealth. We sure don't want to stand in the way of competitiveness, now do we?? 🙄
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18 Feb 22
@mchill saidOh I empathise fully. It’s one of the reasons I supported Brexit, to prevent what happened to you happening in various places in the uk.
You can either have freedom of movement of labour, or you can have higher paid “protected” jobs with less employment competitiveness.
It's so convenient to debate the details of this sitting at our computers, but if you were one of those hundreds of laid off workers forced to live on the streets, and in your cars, bankrupt and hungry, while the fat cat company execs got ...[text shortened]... n the bulk of the wealth. We sure don't want to stand in the way of competitiveness, now do we?? 🙄
The side point I’m making here is that (and correct me if I’m wrong) but you were one of the people who made posts against Brexit in the debates forum. You weren’t unpleasant about it but I seem to remember you being anti.
Anyway it is interesting to me when I see stories like yours complaining about cheap labour taking your jobs and the same people arguing for the free movement and employment of people who due to their home economics, are happy to work for much less.