Reason and faith???

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
[b]And you are wrong about Mariah Carey. She is hideous.
I should have clarified, "For the heterosexuals..."

You other guys can at least appreciate her costumes, right?[/b]

I appreciate her breasts. But that's all.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
The subjective and transient attributes were not the point; the external source agreeing with an internal standard was the point.

I still dont get it. You made it clear that beauty is purely subjective. You provide further evidence of this by pointing out that heterosexuals may have a different view of beauty than others. Therefore it cannot be based on an internal standard. In my oppinion the same applies to morals. My query was why you draw a different conclusion after trying to draw a parallel between the two.

Originally posted by twhitehead
I still dont get it. You made it clear that beauty is purely subjective. You provide further evidence of this by pointing out that heterosexuals may have a different view of beauty than others. Therefore it cannot be based on an internal standard. In my oppinion the same applies to morals. My query was why you draw a different conclusion after trying to draw a parallel between the two.

Actually, beauty is not subjective. In its many forms, it may appear subjective, especially when the name is often misapplied. Nonetheless...
How one arrives at the idea of beauty is the issue. There is an external source agreeing with an internal standard.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Actually, beauty is not subjective. In its many forms, it may appear subjective, especially when the name is often misapplied. Nonetheless...
How one arrives at the idea of beauty is the issue. There is an external source agreeing with an internal standard.

Well maybe you need to give more detail on that as the example you gave implied the opposite. You said that people should find Mariah Carey beautifull but that everyone would have a different reason for drawing that conclusion even going to the extent of saying "What may repel one person may attract another." Surely this implies that beauty is entirely subjective?

Using her as our touchstone, MC's many facets serve to offer at least one thing which most would agree on as beautiful. Like Dottewell, I find most of her unattractive, but yet there are a few aspects which I can (begrudgingly) agree are attractive, or beautiful.

What makes me say this? She [the external source] possesses a thing (or two) which I like [internal source] to see.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Using her as our touchstone, MC's many facets serve to offer at least one thing which most would agree on as beautiful. Like Dottewell, I find most of her unattractive, but yet there are a few aspects which I can (begrudgingly) agree are attractive, or beautiful.

What makes me say this? She [the external source] possesses a thing (or two) which I like [internal source] to see.

So do you agree that the beauty of the bits that you do like do not posses any attributes that are inherantly beautifull in and of themselves but require you to like them for them to be beautiful for you. In addition do you agree that other people may not find them beautifull. Therefore beauty is entirely subjective.

Originally posted by twhitehead
So do you agree that the beauty of the bits that you do like do not posses any attributes that are inherantly beautifull in and of themselves but require you to like them for them to be beautiful for you. In addition do you agree that other people may not find them beautifull. Therefore beauty is entirely subjective.

Used in this analogy, as it relates to attractiveness? Of course. Again, how one arrives at their conclusion of beauty is the issue.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
but yet there are a few aspects which I can (begrudgingly) agree are attractive, or beautiful.

There are two. And I would say "hypnotic" rather than "attractive".

Originally posted by twhitehead
Well maybe you need to give more detail on that as the example you gave implied the opposite. You said that people should find Mariah Carey beautifull but that everyone would have a different reason for drawing that conclusion even going to the extent of saying "What may repel one person may attract another." Surely this implies that beauty is entirely subjective?

it's funny you talk about Mariah Carey like that, cause i am repeled from her. it shouldn't make any justifiable sense cause i've never met her. it's just when my ex got really toasted she would sing like her idol, Mariah Carey. shut up. shut (naughty words inside) up! repulsion. yep that's me. logical. no.