Originally posted by Badwater
Creation stories are getting mixed here. In the second creation story, the one concerning Adam and Eve, there is no indication at all that Adam and Eve (and the rest of creation) are "very good". Only the Tree of Knowledge is specifically described in the second creation story in terms of the knowledge of good and evil. And since the tree divines such knowl the creations stories would bear out his assertion to them being allegorical and not factual.
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Creation stories are getting mixed here. In the second creation story, the one concerning Adam and Eve, there is no indication at all that Adam and Eve (and the rest of creation) are "very good".
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The second account starting
(Genesis 2:25) is not a opposing account in the sense that you imagine. It
is another angle of the same thing - an account with a particular focus which is not detailed in the first account.
There is no need to repeat everything that was covered in the first account ending with
Genesis 2:3. There is no need to assume that the opposite is true in the second account concerning God observing that His creation was
"very good".
Why would you assume that the exact opposite would be the case in the second account? Silence concerning the seventh day and God's resting in satisfaction is not sufficient reason to assume the opposite of
Genesis 1:31 is the case in
Genesis 2:4-25.
Though I do see two sections, I do not see sufficient reason to say that the second section contradicts and opposes the first.
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Only the Tree of Knowledge is specifically described in the second creation story in terms of the knowledge of good and evil. And since the tree divines such knowledge, it can only be logically concluded that both good and evil exist, in spite of the fact that Adam and Eve are ignorant of that existence and are thus swayed by a persuasive serpent.
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The first account says that everything that God observed that He created was
very good. The prior existence of an enemy of God we may say surely was not very good. However, as long as Adam was in charge and obedient to God it was very good. What was good was that Adam was the deputy authority on the earth.
As long as Adam did not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil the ground would not be cursed.
Whatever "evil" there existed left over from a previous era, it was in check as long as Adam remained obedient to God.
So the existence of a tree of the knowledge of good and evil does not demand that there was no evil. Rather it was very good that all things were under Adam's obedient deputy authority.
That ended when Adam ate of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
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The creation stories are completely different and mixing them will cause enormous problems of logic.
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I don't think that refering to each story to get a complete picture causes serious problems in logic. At least not so serious as to lead me to say "Well one must be right and the other wrong."
Two accounts with somewhat different focuses do not demand that I choose one or the other.
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To believe in one at the expense of the other shows a lack of spiritual depth to me. It certainly shows a high disregard for simple logic.
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You are certainly welcomed to your opinion on that. I could use more spiritual depth.
However, to me your reasons, I think are not valid.
Your logic seems to be that something not specifically mentioned in
Genesis 2:4-25 of necessity must be the
opposite to its mention in
Genesis 1:1-31
Where is the soundness in that logic?
The first account simply says in a general way that God made them male and female. In the second account it goes into detail as to how God made them male and female. Is that a contradiction? No it is not.
I don't see any reason to assume that the creation was not also
very good in the eyes of God in the second account. That is as long as Adam remained faithful to God, which came out of the decision of his free will.
I see a different focus on particlar details. I do not see valid logic neccesitating that the opposite of
Gen. 1:31 has to be in anywhere in
Genesis 2:4-25.
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I won't speak for deucer but will only say that the logical flow of the creations stories would bear out his assertion to them being allegorical and not factual.
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The flow of history from Genesis is seamless. Adam is mentioned on more than one geneology. Luke traces Christ's ancestory back to Adam the first man.
First Chronicles traces a geneology including Adam.
And Cain moved east of Eden. It is hard to locate yourself
east of any allegorical place.
The teaching of Jesus suggest strongly that He regarded Genesis as history. Paul of course regarded Genesis as history.
The fact that it was history does not necessitate that there were not some deeper symbolic matters being portrayed in the history. History verses allegory for Genesis is a false dichotomy.