1. Standard memberColetti
    W.P. Extraordinaire
    State of Franklin
    Joined
    13 Aug '03
    Moves
    21735
    11 May '05 21:54
    I find it interesting that whenever I am debating about any Biblical events and issues - the first rules seems to be - pretend like God does not exist.

    Now I can understand this with my opponents. I mean, with God on my side, I have an advantage. God is by definition a supernatural being, who supersedes the laws of nature. Nothing is impossible for God.

    But why should I deny God when I am debating things like the flood, or a 6-day creation. Wouldn't that be the supreme example of absurdity to argue about acts of God by first assuming God is not God?

    So all you who wish to argue about the contents of the Bible - please explain why you think it is reasonable to first pretend like God does not exist? Is there any reason that is not the following: it gives the Christian theist an unfair advantage?
  2. Standard memberRBHILL
    Acts 13:48
    California
    Joined
    21 May '03
    Moves
    223260
    11 May '05 22:03
    Originally posted by Coletti
    I find it interesting that whenever I am debating about any Biblical events and issues - the first rules seems to be - pretend like God does not exist.

    Now I can understand this with my opponents. I mean, with God on my side, I have an advantage. God is by definition a supernatural being, who supersedes the laws of nature. Nothing is impossible for God ...[text shortened]... s there any reason that is not the following: it gives the Christian theist an unfair advantage?
    how can you pretend he doesn't exist, when in fact he do exist.
  3. Standard memberNemesio
    Ursulakantor
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Joined
    05 Mar '02
    Moves
    32455
    11 May '05 22:08
    Originally posted by RBHILL
    how can you pretend he doesn't exist, when in fact he do exist.
    Just do the same thing you do when you pretend that there are no
    literal contradictions in the Bible.

    Nemesio
  4. Standard memberNemesio
    Ursulakantor
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Joined
    05 Mar '02
    Moves
    32455
    11 May '05 22:10
    Originally posted by Coletti
    I find it interesting that whenever I am debating about any Biblical events and issues - the first rules seems to be - pretend like God does not exist.

    Now I can understand this with my opponents. I mean, with God on my side, I have an advantage. God is by definition a supernatural being, who supersedes the laws of nature. Nothing is impossible for God ...[text shortened]... s there any reason that is not the following: it gives the Christian theist an unfair advantage?
    No one is asking you to suspend your belief in a Supreme Being.

    They are asking you to critically evaluate what you believe.

    For example, in order to believe that Creation took place 6k years ago,
    you have to deny about 20 different branches of science. In order to
    disbelieve it, you have to reject a literaly reading of a book written
    3000 years ago, a book that was taken figuratively when it was written
    in the first place.

    Which is more reasonable?

    Nemesio
  5. Standard memberColetti
    W.P. Extraordinaire
    State of Franklin
    Joined
    13 Aug '03
    Moves
    21735
    11 May '05 22:10
    Originally posted by Nemesio
    Just do the same thing you do when you pretend that there are no
    literal contradictions in the Bible.

    Nemesio
    I expected something more insightful from you Nemesio.
  6. Standard memberNemesio
    Ursulakantor
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Joined
    05 Mar '02
    Moves
    32455
    11 May '05 22:11
    Originally posted by Coletti
    I expected something more insightful from you Nemesio.
    When RBHILL gives me material that warrants insight, I'll give it.

    Nemesio
  7. Joined
    16 Dec '04
    Moves
    97738
    11 May '05 22:14
    Originally posted by Nemesio
    Just do the same thing you do when you pretend that there are no
    literal contradictions in the Bible.

    Nemesio
    I hope the day does not come when you stand in judgement, and all you can say is "Contadictions, what about those Contradictins." And the LORD says, "Contradictions,there were no contradictions, you just used that as an excuse, not to accept The Salvation that I offered."
  8. Standard memberRBHILL
    Acts 13:48
    California
    Joined
    21 May '03
    Moves
    223260
    11 May '05 22:20
    Originally posted by Nemesio
    Just do the same thing you do when you pretend that there are no
    literal contradictions in the Bible.

    Nemesio
    There are no contradictions in the Bible, you are a human that is why you do not understand it, God MUST reveal the truth of it to you to understand it.

    Romans 10:17
  9. Standard memberColetti
    W.P. Extraordinaire
    State of Franklin
    Joined
    13 Aug '03
    Moves
    21735
    11 May '05 22:21
    Originally posted by Nemesio
    No one is asking you to suspend your belief in a Supreme Being.

    They are asking you to critically evaluate what you believe.

    For example, in order to believe that Creation took place 6k years ago,
    you have to deny about 20 different branches of science. In order to
    disbelieve it, you have to reject a literaly reading of a book written
    3000 years ag ...[text shortened]... en figuratively when it was written
    in the first place.

    Which is more reasonable?

    Nemesio
    I would like you to list those 20 branches of science and then give tell me how the scientists in those branches have become the source of absolute truth..
  10. Standard memberRBHILL
    Acts 13:48
    California
    Joined
    21 May '03
    Moves
    223260
    11 May '05 22:22
    Originally posted by blindfaith101
    I hope the day does not come when you stand in judgement, and all you can say is "Contadictions, what about those Contradictins." And the LORD says, "Contradictions,there were no contradictions, you just used that as an excuse, not to accept The Salvation that I offered."
    Praise God! the best quote I heard all day.
  11. Joined
    24 Apr '05
    Moves
    3061
    11 May '05 22:27
    Originally posted by Coletti
    I find it interesting that whenever I am debating about any Biblical events and issues - the first rules seems to be - pretend like God does not exist.

    Now I can understand this with my opponents. I mean, with God on my side, I have an advantage. God is by definition a supernatural being, who supersedes the laws of nature. Nothing is impossible for God ...[text shortened]... s there any reason that is not the following: it gives the Christian theist an unfair advantage?
    not that i go around trying to pick fights about the bible, but i find it very difficult to take seriously most arguments that are in favor of the bible. invariably, to me, the argument in favor of the bible seems to boil down to stating that the bible is right because it is the bible -- in as much as it was written by men, but breathed by god.

    this argument is in my opinion virtually content-free. and the natural question to ask to such an argument is 'yeah, but what if god doesn't exist' -- then the argument in favor of the bible completely crumbles. this doesn't show that the bible is false -- it only shows that you cannot prove the existence of something that is based on faith.

    i agree with you that in such debates it is not fair to start by saying 'let's first assume god doesn't exist.' but a natural (and different) starting place is to ask what happens to the theist's argument when the assumption that god exists breaks down. invariably, i find these questions are not satisfactorily answered by the theist (how could they be, given that he has faith, not proof?).
  12. Standard memberfrogstomp
    Bruno's Ghost
    In a hot place
    Joined
    11 Sep '04
    Moves
    7707
    11 May '05 22:29
    Originally posted by Nemesio
    When RBHILL gives me material that warrants insight, I'll give it.

    Nemesio
    are you prepared to wait for the condemned souls to have to wear overcoats to keeps from catching cold ?
  13. Standard memberfrogstomp
    Bruno's Ghost
    In a hot place
    Joined
    11 Sep '04
    Moves
    7707
    11 May '05 22:32
    Originally posted by RBHILL
    There are no contradictions in the Bible, you are a human that is why you do not understand it, God MUST reveal the truth of it to you to understand it.

    Romans 10:17
    More Paulie doctrine ?,,,, he aint god nor did he ever meet Christ.
  14. Standard memberfrogstomp
    Bruno's Ghost
    In a hot place
    Joined
    11 Sep '04
    Moves
    7707
    11 May '05 22:35
    Originally posted by LemonJello
    not that i go around trying to pick fights about the bible, but i find it very difficult to take seriously most arguments that are in favor of the bible. invariably, to me, the argument in favor of the bible seems to boil down to stating that [b]the bible is right because it is the bible -- in as much as it was written by men, but breathed by god.
    ...[text shortened]... isfactorily answered by the theist (how could they be, given that he has faith, not proof?).
    [/b]
    Its far more unfair to have a debate with one side having a wild card to trump any argument it's losing on the merits
  15. Standard memberColetti
    W.P. Extraordinaire
    State of Franklin
    Joined
    13 Aug '03
    Moves
    21735
    11 May '05 22:37
    Originally posted by LemonJello
    ...i agree with you that in such debates it is not fair to start by saying 'let's first assume god doesn't exist.' but a natural (and different) starting place is to ask what happens to the theist's argument when the assumption that god exists breaks down. invariably, i find these questions are not satisfactorily answered by the theist (how could they be, given that he has faith, not proof?).
    I agree with you if I were trying to prove the existence of God - I do not. And I think ultimately the authority of the Bible is founded on faith. But I have not found any argument that really counters the justification of this faith except by those who presume something that axiomatically invalidate that faith - in fact, it is only by faith that anyone bases any counter arguments against the Bible - faith in science, faith in interpretations of empirical data that presume that there is no God or the Bible is not God's Word. The final position comes down to this - wherein lies your faith.
Back to Top