1. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    13 Feb '13 02:251 edit
    Sure Things

    There's an adage in gambling circles that suggests bettors,

    "Never bet it all on a sure thing unless you'll have enough left for taxi fare home".

    Within this forum, 'Faith Alone in Christ Alone' represents a prohibitive long shot.

    As M. Pancoast observed, "The truth will set you free

    but first it will piss you off".
    .
  2. Joined
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    13 Feb '13 09:391 edit
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    [b]Sure Things

    There's an adage in gambling circles that suggests bettors,

    "Never bet it all on a sure thing unless you'll have enough left for taxi fare home".

    Within this forum, 'Faith Alone in Christ Alone' represents a prohibitive long shot.

    As M. Pancoast observed, "The truth will set you free

    but first it will piss you off".
    .[/b]
    You are continuing your bid to be crowned as the fridge magnet king.

    There are few stakes higher than life or death. And when gambling with your life it's a generally a case
    of win it all or lose it all.

    Now there is a very very very small probability that all the air molecules in the room you are in will suddenly
    rush into a corner of the room leaving you to die horribly and painfully in a total vacuum.

    While it is a "sure thing" by your analogy that this wont happen... Should you still wear a space suit just in case?



    As M. Pancoast observed, "The truth will set you free

    but first it will piss you off".



    This might well be true.

    However it is highly overused by people who don't have any truth, like you.

    The truth often pisses people off... But so does untruth.

    Your position pisses me off.
    Mine pisses off you.

    Our positions are mutually exclusive and can't both be true, and as they are not the only options they could both be false.

    Thus it helps neither of us to quote M. Pancoast, because it does nothing to determine which, if either, of us is right.



    Faith is demonstrably the worst way of determining truth short of determining what is true and then deliberately
    believing the opposite [if that is actually possible].
    Faith is guessing what is true out of the infinite possibilities available.
    It stands almost no chance of being right, and even when it is, gives you no basis for telling that you are right.


    That is a truth that pisses off many posters on these forums... But the fact it pisses people off is not evidence that
    it's true.
  3. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    13 Feb '13 09:451 edit
    Originally posted by googlefudge

    You are continuing your bid to be crowned as the fridge magnet king.

    There are few stakes higher than life or death. And when gambling with your life it's a generally a case
    of win it all or lose it all.

    Now there is a very very very small probability that all the air molecules in the room you are in will suddenly
    rush into a corner of th sters on these forums... But the fact it pisses people off is not evidence that
    it's true.
    "You are continuing your bid to be crowned as the fridge magnet king."

    Fridge Magnet King thinks GF's finally beginning to like him.
    .
  4. Joined
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    13 Feb '13 09:55
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    "You are continuing your bid to be crowned as the fridge magnet king."

    Fridge Magnet King thinks GF's finally beginning to like him.
    .
    No, for that to happen you would need to stop believing I am going to spend an eternity being tortured in hell and deserve it.
  5. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    13 Feb '13 10:132 edits
    Originally posted by googlefudge

    No, for that to happen you would need to stop believing I am going to spend an eternity being tortured in hell and deserve it.
    If Fridge stopped being concerned, he wouldn't have much basis for caring about GF's Eternal Destiny in the first place.

    http://www.howarddavidjohnson.com/mystic.htm
    .
  6. Joined
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    13 Feb '13 11:57
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    If Fridge stopped being concerned, he wouldn't have much basis for caring about GF's Eternal Destiny in the first place.

    http://www.howarddavidjohnson.com/mystic.htm
    .
    There is no eternal destiny to care about.



    So what you are saying is that you are incapable of caring about another human being unless your religion is correct?

    Because that sounds like that's a problem with you.
  7. Standard memberGrampy Bobby
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    13 Feb '13 23:13
    Originally posted by googlefudge

    There is no eternal destiny to care about.



    So what you are saying is that you are incapable of caring about another human being unless your religion is correct?

    Because that sounds like that's a problem with you.
    "a] There is no eternal destiny to care about.

    b] So what you are saying is that you are incapable of caring
    about another human being unless your religion is correct?

    c] Because that sounds like that's a problem with you."

    .....................................

    a] Why, then, bother with conversations about vertical issues and eternal things? All 'religions' are manmade; all peddle half truths mixed with error, falsehoods and subtle lies. Christianity, alone, is a permanent relationship with an Eternal Being. His Perfect Integrity enables Him to love with a Perfect Love. He never vacillates or changes because He's Immutable.

    b] There are many 'problems' with the flawed characters of depraved human beings. As you may recall, the Apostle Paul openly stated that he was 'Chief among sinners'. I have no illusions as to where his brutal objectivity places me.

    c] Unfortunate if you perceive my comments in that way. There is nothing on the table except my concern for you.
    .
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    14 Feb '13 01:141 edit
    . .
  9. Standard memberRJHinds
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    14 Feb '13 01:19
    Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
    [b]Sure Things

    There's an adage in gambling circles that suggests bettors,

    "Never bet it all on a sure thing unless you'll have enough left for taxi fare home".

    Within this forum, 'Faith Alone in Christ Alone' represents a prohibitive long shot.

    As M. Pancoast observed, "The truth will set you free

    but first it will piss you off".
    .[/b]
    It is something like playing the lottery. You have lots of chances to lose, but you can't win the big one if you don't play. 😏 The atheist has already decided that he can not win anyway, so he just tries to ignore the game.
  10. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    14 Feb '13 07:46
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    It is something like playing the lottery. You have lots of chances to lose, but you can't win the big one if you don't play. 😏 The atheist has already decided that he can not win anyway, so he just tries to ignore the game.
    There is no game.
    The game is just in your heads.
    And you are all losers.
  11. SubscriberSuzianne
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    14 Feb '13 19:46
    Originally posted by googlefudge
    No, for that to happen you would need to stop believing I am going to spend an eternity being tortured in hell and deserve it.
    I don't believe that at all, GF.

    I mean there's no doubt that all of us will deserve what we get, but eternal torture for you? Nah, I don't think so. However, I do grieve that before your judgement is carried out, you will have plenty of time to regret that you didn't listen to us a lot more closely.
  12. Joined
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    14 Feb '13 23:37
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    I don't believe that at all, GF.

    I mean there's no doubt that all of us will deserve what we get, but eternal torture for you? Nah, I don't think so. However, I do grieve that before your judgement is carried out, you will have plenty of time to regret that you didn't listen to us a lot more closely.
    I do not believe that your god exists.

    I have never believed that your god exists.

    Unless evidence is supplied sufficient to justify it I will never believe that your god exists
    (barring brain damage but then I will have stopped being me so my point stands).

    And even if I were convinced that your god does exist, that we have souls, and the there
    really is a heaven and hell I still wont worship your god (or any other).



    So please answer this question.

    Given the above, what does your religion say will happen to me after I die?


    When you answer that the bible is unequivocal about what awaits people who don't believe
    in or worship your god (they go to hell for an eternity of torture)...

    Please answer this question.

    Do you think that people sent to hell simply for not believing in god deserve to spend an eternity
    being punished for not believing in god?
  13. SubscriberSuzianne
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    15 Feb '13 00:27
    Originally posted by googlefudge
    I do not believe that your god exists.

    I have never believed that your god exists.

    Unless evidence is supplied sufficient to justify it I will never believe that your god exists
    (barring brain damage but then I will have stopped being me so my point stands).

    And even if I were convinced that your god does exist, that we have souls, and the the ...[text shortened]... or not believing in god deserve to spend an eternity
    being punished for not believing in god?
    I told you I didn't believe that.

    Didn't I start off by saying that? Didn't I?

    I don't believe anyone deserves being punished for all eternity. All eternity is a real, REAL long time.

    I believe that after the judgement, those found lacking will be sent to the lake of fire, yes, but it will be for the second death, the death of the soul. Your ticket will be punched and you'll be gone. It might hurt, but only for a little while. No eternal torture forever and ever, amen. But you'll know that's where you're going, and you'll know for certain that there is a God and that He has passed His righteous judgement upon you and that it was your own fault that you'll never know your Creator and that you'll forever be separated from Him. There will be plenty of time for the gnashing of teeth. Oh, and wailing. Plenty of wailing.

    But you know what? You can still avoid this rather untidy bit of gruesomeness. It's your choice. Yeah, Free Will! Cool, huh? No worries, mon! Be happy!
  14. Standard memberRJHinds
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    15 Feb '13 01:012 edits
    Originally posted by googlefudge
    I do not believe that your god exists.

    I have never believed that your god exists.

    Unless evidence is supplied sufficient to justify it I will never believe that your god exists
    (barring brain damage but then I will have stopped being me so my point stands).

    And even if I were convinced that your god does exist, that we have souls, and the the or not believing in god deserve to spend an eternity
    being punished for not believing in god?
    Jesus is the Christian God and I think there is pretty good evidence He exists. He commanded His disciples to teach and baptize in His name. That was the way He established His church all over the world. He proved He had the power over death by coming back to life after being crucified. He left the empty tomb for us to visit and His image on His burial cloth, which is under control of the Roman Catholic Church, as a testimony for those that were not there. The truth is what it is regardless of what you believe.

    The eternal torment you will receive is for your sins you have committed. The chief among these will be for your failure to confess and repent of your sins and ask our great God and Savior for forgiveness. Don't think you will be getting off easy as Suzianne says. That's not going to happen. It will not be fair to the rest of us.

    HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Holy! Holy! Holy!
  15. SubscriberSuzianne
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    15 Feb '13 01:19
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    The eternal torment you will receive is for your sins you have committed. The chief among these will be for your failure to confess and repent of your sins and ask our great God and Savior for forgiveness. Don't think you will be getting off easy as Suzianne says. That's not going to happen. It will not be fair to the rest of us.

    HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Holy! Holy! Holy!
    What do you mean it's not fair to the rest of us? Not fair?? To the rest of us?? What about them??

    I don't want to see sinners burning in torment for all eternity. Are you saying that you do?

    Vengeance belongs to the Lord, Ron. Not you. I think perhaps He's better qualified to use it judiciously, and not out of revenge.
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