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    23 Feb '14 15:05
    Amazing! The bible tells us that the stones are anisotropic But no one knew that back then, except for god of course.

    Revelation 21:19
    The wall was made of jasper, and the city was pure gold, as clear as glass. 19The wall of the city was built on foundation stones inlaid with twelve precious stones the first was jasper, the second sapphire, the third agate, the fourth emerald, 20the fifth onyx, the sixth carnelian, the seventh chrysolite, the eighth beryl, the ninth topaz, the tenth chrysoprase, the eleventh jacinth, the twelfth amethyst.

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  2. Standard memberRJHinds
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    23 Feb '14 17:191 edit
    Originally posted by tim88
    Amazing! The bible tells us that the stones are anisotropic But no one knew that back then, except for god of course.

    Revelation 21:19
    The wall was made of jasper, and the city was pure gold, as clear as glass. 19The wall of the city was built on foundation stones inlaid with twelve precious stones the first was jasper, the second sapphire, the third agat ...[text shortened]... prase, the eleventh jacinth, the twelfth amethyst.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrdCru5Q6lQ
    There are 12 stones which will be used as the material for the New Jerusalem and everyone of them is anistropic. Look it up for yourself in Revelation 21:19 and Revelation 21:20.

    If you shine pure light through a slice of a precious stone 2 things can happen, 1: the slice will lose all of its colour and look like coal. Or 2: The slice will change from its present colour, , into all the colours of the rainbow and the most wonderful patterns beyond imagination. These stones are Anisotropic, The stones that lose their colour are isotropic.

    In Revelation 21 it is stated that 12 different precious stones will be used to build the New Jerusalem walls, and they are all Anisotropic, they don't lose their colour... How could anyone have known this at that time?? the truth is: no one could. only God could know.

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  3. Standard membersonship
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    23 Feb '14 20:104 edits
    It is interesting what has been written about the stones. However the stones are symbolic. The stones signify something besides their actual physical selves.

    The entire vision of New Jerusalem is a "sign" which means it is a symbolic pointer to a profound reality. Many things in Revelation are signs, it was told John that the vision was made known to him by signs -


    "The revelation of Jesus Christ which God gave to Him to show to His slaves the things that must quickly take place; and He made is known by signs, sending it by His angel to His slave John." (Rev. 1:1)


    The twelve manner of precious stones that constitute the wall of the New Jerusalem represents transformed human beings. That is human beings who have been saved by Jesus Christ, regenerated, resurrection (if having died), conformed, transformed, sanctified and built up together to be a "city".

    They were fallen sinners.
    They entered into God's full salvation.
    They eventually are conformed to the image Christ the Firstborn Son of God.

    Right here -

    "Because those whom He foreknew, He also predestinated to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the Firstborn among many brothers.

    And those whom He predestinated, these He also called; and those whom He called, these He also justified; and those whom He justified, thee He also glorified." (Romans 8:29,30)


    The precious stones the redeemed and saved people down through all time who eventually become transformed sons of God built up in love as a corporate city vessel to contain the shining yet invisible Divine Being - the Triune God Himself.
  4. Standard membersonship
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    23 Feb '14 20:241 edit
    Jesus Christ is the UNIQUE Living Stone. Every saved person becomes a living stone via His all-inclusive salvation and eternal purpose to build a living temple with His saved people.

    The precious stones of twelve kinds symbolize the believers in Christ who have become "living stones" built up into a spiritual house as the Apostle Peter wrote also:

    "Coming to Him [Christ], a living stone, rejected by men but with God chosen and precious,

    You yourselves also, as living stones, are being built up a spiritual house into a holy priesthood to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ." ( 1 Peter 2:4,5)


    These twelve types of precious stones are therefore living human beings transformed to be really living with the eternal life of God their Father. God's life has gotten into them to transform them and build them up together.

    It is a matter of "Once Saved - Transformed for Eternity."

    You might say that men of clay, though heat and pressure and water, becomes men of precious gem like nature - precious gems. This signifies that God has used all the troubles of the universe caused by Satan to backfire upon Satan and instead go to produce the living dwelling place of God - "New Jerusalem".
  5. Standard membersonship
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    23 Feb '14 21:242 edits
    The wall of the city New Jerusalem in Revelation 21,22 is made up of precious stones.

    A WALL is for protection and separation. The wall of the city is there to keep WITHIN the city the interests of God. And the wall is to keep the things nor pertaining to God's interests OUT of the city.

    The wall made of precious stones speaks of transformed men keeping within God's kingdom His interests and keeping the things contrary to God's interests OUT of the kingdom.

    This is not a new theme. This is a theme going back to the creation of Adam. Adam was told to guard the garden. Adam was to keep the garden. Adam was to cause the things not pertaining to the interests of God out of the paradise of God.

    In the end of history God obtains a corporate man who is built up in salvation to be a wall protecting the interests of God.

    It is absolutely the case that the garden in Genesis Two becomes enlarged and built up to be the City in Revelation 21 and 22. The man guarding the garden becomes the collective man transformed to protect the city.

    "Outside [meaning outside of the city wall] are the dogs and the sorcerers and the fornicators and the murderers and the idolators and everyone who practices a lie." (Rev. 22:15)

    We cannot take this too fast or too much for granted. The meaning here is not that there is no outside of the city except the damned or the cursed. Latter I will show that there are nations outside of the city walking in the light of the city.

    However, it does mean that no cursed humanity, no sinful humanity, no godless humanity, no humanity poisoned by Satan or sickened by sin or corrupted by transgression of the law has part in this eternal salvation of the Triune God.

    Man - the NEW man in God's eternal purpose has kept out of himself all that offends God - all that is immoral, filthy, unholy, demonic, occultic, murderous, and Satanic and fallen - is walled OUT of the living temple of God.

    It is a living temple because it is composed of God built into man and man built into God. God and man are built together to be a corporate living "city" Bride and dwelling place of the Triune God for eternity.

    The number 12 speaks of perfection in eternity.
    The perfect cycle in time is represented by the number 7.
    The perfect cycle in eternity is represented by the number 12.

    Both numbers 7 and 12 are composed of 4 and 3. But they are composed differently.

    The number 7 is composed with 4 added to 3 or 3 added to 4.
    The number 12 is composed by a mixing of 3 and 4 in multiplication.

    Three stands here for the Triune God - Father - Son - Holy Spirit.
    Four stands for the creation of God, mainly humanity as God's creation.
    That is as four winds, four living creatures, four corners of the earth etc. That is the creation of God

    Therefore the sevens used so much in Revelation (seven Spirits, seven eyes, seven lampstands, seven churches, seven seven seals, seven trumpets, seven thunders, seven vials) all speak of something of God bringing His creation man to Himself in time.

    The twelve months, The twelve gates, twelve foundations, twelve manner of fruits, twelve angels, twelve names of the tribes of Israel, and twelve foundations with the names of the twelve apostles speak of God mingling Himself with His ceatures as in four times three or three times four.

    The three gates on each of the four sides of the city clue us that we should understand twelve here as three times four.

    The mingling of God and man is for God's eternal purpose.
    The mingling of God into man is for the building of His living dwelling place where God indwells the transformed humanity to be a corporate expression of the Triune God in man for eternity.

    Think of the conclusion of God's will for eternity to be the mass production of His Son Jesus Christ. That is the multiplication of what Christ is.
  6. Standard membersonship
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    23 Feb '14 21:42
    From the Life Study of Revelation by Witness Lee

    http://www.ministrybooks.org/books.cfm?cid=0FD1

    The entire city of New Jerusalem is the Holy of Holies, and God and the Lamb are the temple in this city. If we put these two points together, we shall realize that this city is God and the Lamb. Because the whole city is the Holy of Holies and because the inner temple is God and the Lamb, the city is God and the Lamb.

    Furthermore, the whole city is called the tabernacle (v. 3). Just as a boy is the precursor of a man, so the tabernacle is the precursor of the temple. Before the temple appears, there is the tabernacle. But when the tabernacle comes into its fullness, it becomes the temple. Therefore, we need to keep three points before us: that the whole city is the Holy of Holies; that the temple is God Himself and the Lamb; and that the whole city is the tabernacle. When we put all these points together, we see that God Himself is the whole city of New Jerusalem.

    However, as we have pointed out elsewhere, the whole city of New Jerusalem is also a living composition of all God’s redeemed ones. On the one hand, God is the entire city; on the other hand, the city is a living composition of the redeemed. If you find this difficult to grasp with your natural mind, let me ask you this question: Do we not say that the church today is Christ, and do we not also say that it is a composition of all the believers? On the one hand, the church is a composition of all the believers; on the other hand, Christ is both the Head and the Body. Hence, we have the term, the Body-Christ. First Corinthians 12:12 indicates that Christ is not only the Head, but also the Body: “For as the body is one, and hath many members, and all the members of that one body, being many, are one body: so also is Christ.” The principle in both the church and New Jerusalem is the same. [quote]

    [quote] The New Jerusalem is both the temple and the tabernacle. This means that New Jerusalem will not only be the enlargement of God, the temple, but also the tabernacle, God and the Lamb overshadowing His redeemed with Himself as the tabernacle. Revelation 7:15, speaking of the great multitude serving God in the heavenly temple, says, “Therefore they are before the throne of God, and serve Him day and night in His temple; and He who sits upon the throne shall spread His tabernacle over them.” God shall overshadow His redeemed ones by spreading Himself over them. In Psalm 90:1 Moses said, “Lord, thou hast been our dwelling place in all generations.” Moses knew that God Himself is our eternal dwelling place, our eternal habitation. Psalm 90 is a prophecy of this. I do not care to live in a heavenly mansion. I prefer to dwell in God, even in the enlargement of God. Our natural mind would never think that we could dwell in God. Nevertheless, the entire city of New Jerusalem will be God Himself as our habitation. The expansion and the enlargement of God will be our eternal city in which we shall dwell for eternity. All of God’s redeemed will serve and dwell in God and the Lamb as the temple.
  7. Standard membersonship
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    23 Feb '14 21:53
    from Life Study of Revelation by Witness Lee

    http://www.ministrybooks.org/books.cfm?p

    C. Built with Twelve Precious Stones

    Verse 19 says, “The foundations of the wall of the city were adorned with every precious stone.” This verse and the next list the names of twelve precious stones, which are the twelve apostles of the Lamb, each of whom is signified by a precious stone. When Peter, the first of the twelve apostles, was brought to the Lord, the Lord changed his name to Cephas, which means “a stone” (John 1:42). Later, the Lord called him by this name when He spoke concerning the building of His church (Matt. 16:18). Precious stones are not created, but are transformed from something that has been created. All the apostles were created as clay, but they were regenerated and transformed into precious stones for God’s eternal building. This regeneration and transformation is required of every believer who will be a part of the New Jerusalem.

    The foundations of the wall of the city are of twelve layers. Once again, the number twelve shows the completion in God’s eternal administration. The first layer is jasper, indicating that the likeness of God is the predominant appearance. The first layer of the wall’s foundation, as well as the entire wall of New Jerusalem, is built with jasper. This indicates that the main material in the building of the holy city is jasper. Since jasper signifies God expressed in His communicable glory, the main function of the holy city is to express God in bearing His glory (v. 11).

    Now we must consider a very important matter regarding the twelve foundations. Although the entire wall is jasper, the twelve foundations are different stones with various colors. Each layer is different from the others. The reason for this is that the apostles had different ministries. Paul’s ministry was different from Peter’s, and Peter’s was different from John’s. However, these twelve foundations are not laid side by side; rather, they are laid one on top of another. The top layer, the layer that met the bottom of the wall, was jasper, the same color as the wall. Thus, all the work of the apostles issued in the same appearance, jasper. All twelve layers lead to and support the unique testimony in the unique expression.

    The work of many so-called Christian workers leads to an individualistic appearance. But the work of the apostles led to one appearance. Today’s Christian workers not only have different colors; instead of being one on top of another, they are side by side. Thus, they have an individualistic expression, sometimes even with competition and striving with one another. The work of the apostles, on the contrary, was layer upon layer and led to the unique appearance of jasper, the appearance of God in Christ.
  8. Standard memberRJHinds
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    24 Feb '14 00:041 edit
    JEWISH HIGH PRIEST GARMENTS

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    I was thinking about these 12 stones and I recalled that the High Priest had a breast plate with 12 stones representing the 12 tribes of Israel described in Exodus 28. I was wondering if these 12 stones were the same as those of Revelation 21. But I was unable to determine for sure because the exact translation from the ancient Hebrew is not known for all the stones according to this commentator on the video.

    This video was good for me to see for I now realize I have not been a good represntative of our Lord Jesus and needed some humbling in my attitude.
  9. Standard membersonship
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    24 Feb '14 00:22
    Originally posted by RJHinds
    JEWISH HIGH PRIEST GARMENTS

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jOfYoDJFbcg

    I was thinking about these 12 stones and I recalled that the High Priest had a breast plate with 12 stones representing the 12 tribes of Israel described in Exodus 28. I was wondering if these 12 stones were the same as those of Revelation 21. But I was unable to determine for sure ...[text shortened]... m the ancient Hebrew is not known for all the stones according to this commentator on the video.
    The theme of stones representing God's people indeed does not start in Revelation. The twelve tribes represented by the twelve stones I think, indicates the same kind of preciousness through consecration to God and His life changing salvation.

    We see the stones in the breastplate of the High Priest. And even further back than that, in Genesis itself.

    I think we should see that God's plan is from His eternal perspective - transcendent over time. His intention has been constant from the beginning.
  10. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    24 Feb '14 01:311 edit
    Originally posted by tim88
    Amazing! The bible tells us that the stones are anisotropic But no one knew that back then, except for god of course.

    Revelation 21:19
    The wall was made of jasper, and the city was pure gold, as clear as glass. 19The wall of the city was built on foundation stones inlaid with twelve precious stones the first was jasper, the second sapphire, the third agat ...[text shortened]... prase, the eleventh jacinth, the twelfth amethyst.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrdCru5Q6lQ
    Most common rock-forming minerals are anisotropic, including quartz and feldspar
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anisotropy

    And its easy to distinguish anisotropic gems you just need one piece of equipment. Its called an eye.

    When looking through a gemstone, you will see one of two things:
    1. A distorted image. (isotropic)
    or
    2. Multiple images. (anisotropic)

    I think Man has been capable of holding up a crystal and looking through for quite sometime ......

    Oh ... all that stuff about polarised light? ... The cretin does not know what he is talking about!
  11. Standard memberRJHinds
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    24 Feb '14 04:11
    Originally posted by wolfgang59
    Most common rock-forming minerals are anisotropic, including quartz and feldspar
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anisotropy

    And its easy to distinguish anisotropic gems you just need one piece of equipment. Its called [b]an eye.


    When looking through a gemstone, you will see one of two things:
    1. A distorted image. (isotropic)
    or
    2. Mu ...[text shortened]... ... all that stuff about polarised light? ... The cretin does not know what he is talking about![/b]
    God gave them an eye. More proof of divine intervention.
  12. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    24 Feb '14 09:02
    Originally posted by tim88
    Amazing!
    Amazing how gullible people are!
  13. Joined
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    24 Feb '14 13:06
    Originally posted by tim88
    Amazing! The bible tells us that the stones are anisotropic But no one knew that back then, except for god of course.

    Revelation 21:19
    The wall was made of jasper, and the city was pure gold, as clear as glass. 19The wall of the city was built on foundation stones inlaid with twelve precious stones the first was jasper, the second sapphire, the third agat ...[text shortened]... prase, the eleventh jacinth, the twelfth amethyst.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrdCru5Q6lQ
    The bible tells us that the stones are anisotropic

    Where in the Bible does it tell us that? All I see here is a small subset of the large number of anisotropic stones they could have used. What is so special about these particular stones?

    --- Penguin
  14. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    25 Feb '14 07:39
    Tim88
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    Come out, come out, wherever you are!

    😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀
  15. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    25 Feb '14 19:29
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