1. EDMONTON ALBERTA
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    21 Jan '06 23:30
    This is how change comes about:
    Desire > Choice > Intent > Change

    We all have a desire to achieve more out of life - to reach a deeper meaning. This desire then provokes a choice which causes many people to choose religion! But this choice does not lead to change. (as we have seen over the 5000 years or so that religion has existed during recorded history)
    What is the natural complimentary discipline to religion?
    The answer is science.
    Science and religion have yery similar areas of focus and this focus is on the nature of reality. On one hand religion claims to have everything figured out about how reality is and how reality works and on the other hand science makes no such claim, science has been constantly searching for the true nature of reality and only creates models to explain what it has discovered thus far.

    Many people take religious teachings literally - this is because they have no scientific discipline. They have made the choice to have the intent to fulfill their desire, which is basically being a sheep to the shepards of religion.
    Many people take scientific teaching literally - they don't understand that we have not reached a complete model and what we do know is only related to the physical, not the non-physical which we are only beginning to delve into (more on this later). These people have no spiritual discipline. They have made the choice to have the intent to fulfill their desire, again being sheeps to the shepards of science.

    The real answer that science and religon come to when they are united is that consciousness is the answer. Science has painstakingly seached through the soup of quantum reality (really really small stuff) to conclude that we create reality!

    For all you religious people who have neglected science, here are some scientific terms:
    Superpositon: two or more particles existing in the same place at once (on top of eachother if it were 2-dimensional). This can also be used to define polarities (which 2-dimensional direction a wave is vibrating in. ie: horizonal, verticle, or anywhere in between) ... it is thought that when we don't measure anything that things exist in a superpositioned state and is mathematically reffered to as a wave function. Once we make a measurement we are collapsing that wave function and the atom or particle we are measuring comes into our reality from that state.

    Quanta: the smallest possible part of anything (which is debatable whether it actually exists) - for instance one quanta of your keyboard would be each key, and they combine to form an inter-relating system which, when stimulated by consciousness, forms these words and ideas you read. (which actually is a good analogy for reality)

    The Uncertainty Principle: When you measure an atom you cannot avoid changing that atom and therefore your measurment actually nullifies its own intent. You cannot know both position and velocity accuratley - the more accurate one is the less accurate the other will be.
    Ok, so those are some basic concepts that have been around since the 1950s or so...
    When we attempt to apply some of these concepts to our own perception of reality and existance we come to some really startling conclusions.
    1) when we close our eyes reality becomes superimposed onto ourselves.
    2) When in this state of superposition we can explore reality, basically determining our courses of action by thought alone. Our thoughts then are brought into reality when we act upon them and they will change reality. (like measuring the atom)
    3) When we are doing something, like making a slam dunk for example, reality becomes solid and we become entirely immersed into that one action - the superpositioned state which existed before we went into that action becomes collapsed into one outcome by our act of doing.

    In the macro world (the everyday world) instead of measurments affecting the superpositioned states it is our actions that affect those states - we are the observer.

    So in conclusion, God as an omnipotent entity is the ultimate observer - the superpositioned state of all observers.

    By searching through ourselves and not delving into any fundamentalism or extreme of belief we can (through prayr or meditation) see ourselves through the eyes of other people we have become, through the eyes of ourselves who we have become, through the eyes of the ultimate observer who we have become - we can then take that perspective and bring it into this reality which will forever change who we are and how we percieve reality.

    The answer to the fundamental question of who is the creator is: WE. (being the superpositioned state of us.)

    WE hold the power to influence reality and WE hold the power to manifest our own destinies - not some disconnected observer in the sky watching over us... for if we choose so, WE can become that observer.

    Ultimatley; balance is the key to hapiness. No extreme of wealth fame or power can grant us this.
  2. Standard memberscottishinnz
    Kichigai!
    Osaka
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    21 Jan '06 23:35
    Originally posted by ChessJester
    This is how change comes about:
    Desire > Choice > Intent > Change

    We all have a desire to achieve more out of life - to reach a deeper meaning. This desire then provokes a choice which causes many people to choose religion! But this choice does not lead to change. (as we have seen over the 5000 years or so that religion has existed during recorded ...[text shortened]... imatley; balance is the key to hapiness. No extreme of wealth fame or power can grant us this.
    You really have to keep off the sherry.
  3. EDMONTON ALBERTA
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    21 Jan '06 23:46
    Originally posted by scottishinnz
    You really have to keep off the sherry.
    You mean alcohol? lol No, consciousness is eternal.
  4. Colorado
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    22 Jan '06 04:42
    Originally posted by ChessJester
    This is how change comes about:
    Desire > Choice > Intent > Change

    We all have a desire to achieve more out of life - to reach a deeper meaning. This desire then provokes a choice which causes many people to choose religion! But this choice does not lead to change. (as we have seen over the 5000 years or so that religion has existed during recorded ...[text shortened]... imatley; balance is the key to hapiness. No extreme of wealth fame or power can grant us this.
    Hey great post! I’ve been meaning to do a thread on quantum mechanics and consciousness for a few weeks now. I guess you beat me to it. You’re quite right. Quantum mechanics currently believes that our consciousness affects reality. Here is a link that shows how this principle has been applied in scientific experiments.

    http://www.spiritofmaat.com/archive/aug1/consciouswater.html
  5. Standard memberscottishinnz
    Kichigai!
    Osaka
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    22 Jan '06 04:44
    Originally posted by The Chess Express
    Hey great post! I’ve been meaning to do a thread on quantum mechanics and consciousness for a few weeks now. I guess you beat me to it. You’re quite right. Quantum mechanics currently believes that our consciousness affects reality. Here is a link that shows how this principle has been applied in scientific experiments.

    http://www.spiritofmaat.com/archive/aug1/consciouswater.html
    I would stake, well, quite a large sum of money on Emoto's "work" being a fake.
  6. Forgotten
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    22 Jan '06 05:041 edit
    Originally posted by ChessJester
    This is how change comes about:
    Desire > Choice > Intent > Change

    We all have a desire to achieve more out of life - to reach a deeper meaning. This desire then provokes a choice which causes many people to choose religion! But this choice does not lead to change. (as we have seen over the 5000 years or so that religion has existed during recorded imatley; balance is the key to hapiness. No extreme of wealth fame or power can grant us this.
    Christ on a crutch.
    Here we go again.Another of our youth rollin or trippin to find God.
  7. Cape Town
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    24 Jan '06 07:53
    Originally posted by ChessJester
    On one hand religion claims to have everything figured out about how reality is ...
    I am not aware of any religion making such a claim. Many religions do claim to know about a God who has everything figured out (but is somehow still strugling to win a never ending battle with the Devil.)
    However it is very clear in most religions that the followers of the religion do not and cannot know everything about God, the universe or even themselves. What answers they do claim to have are often different for each and every member of a religion.

    Most of what you have posted although attempting to claim to fall under the umbrella of science is most deffinately not science.
  8. Account suspended
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    24 Jan '06 08:19
    I've been banned for creating threads with titles in capital letters.
  9. Colorado
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    28 Jan '06 04:54
    Originally posted by sasquatch672
    There you have it. The mysteries of the universe boiled down to five paragraphs. Why didn't I think of that?

    He's right. Keep off the liquor.
    We virtually ignore the astonishing range of scientific and practical applications that quantum mechanics undergirds: today an estimated 30 percent of the U.S. gross national product is based on inventions made possible by quantum mecahnics, from semiconductors in computer chips to lasers in compact-disc players, magnetic resonance imaging in hospitals, and much more.

    Max Tegmark and John Archibald Wheeler Sicnetific American, February 2001
  10. Belfast
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    28 Jan '06 13:46
    I think it's 42.
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