1. Joined
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    15 Sep '11 20:54
    How else are we supposed to explain idiotic blind faith of so many?
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    15 Sep '11 21:23
    Originally posted by trev33
    How else are we supposed to explain idiotic blind faith of so many?
    Hanlon's razor...
    Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity...

    Never attribute to God, that which is adequately explained by stupidity?
  3. Standard memberrvsakhadeo
    rvsakhadeo
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    16 Sep '11 11:19
    Originally posted by trev33
    How else are we supposed to explain idiotic blind faith of so many?
    From Wiki, I have estimated that 2.505 billion adult people on this planet are theists. By adult I mean people between 18 and 65 years age. The christians are 1 billion,muslims are 1 billion,hindus are 0.5 billion,jews are 0.5 million. Total adult population of our planet is about 4.5 billions. So is about half of the total population of earth to be considered idiots?
  4. Joined
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    16 Sep '11 11:34
    Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
    From Wiki, I have estimated that 2.505 billion adult people on this planet are theists. By adult I mean people between 18 and 65 years age. The christians are 1 billion,muslims are 1 billion,hindus are 0.5 billion,jews are 0.5 million. Total adult population of our planet is about 4.5 billions. So is about half of the total population of earth to be considered idiots?
    First you can be wrong without being an idiot.
    There are both really smart and really stupid people in both the theist and atheist camps.

    second, I wonder about your numbers, apart from ignoring a whole host of religions...
    do the figures of number of religious people include children?
    Most religions try to inflate their numbers and so almost certainly include minors in their figures.

    thus the comparison wouldn't be with adult population but with total population.

    Also I don't think you have to reach 18 before being able to make rational decisions about whether
    you are or are not religious.


    That said I would say that belief in god is stupid, and if you go back in time the proportion of the
    population that would have claimed religion gets close to 100%.
    This didn't make them right then, and it doesn't make them right now.
  5. Standard memberrvsakhadeo
    rvsakhadeo
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    16 Sep '11 11:59
    Originally posted by googlefudge
    First you can be wrong without being an idiot.
    There are both really smart and really stupid people in both the theist and atheist camps.

    second, I wonder about your numbers, apart from ignoring a whole host of religions...
    do the figures of number of religious people include children?
    Most religions try to inflate their numbers and so almost certa ...[text shortened]... n gets close to 100%.
    This didn't make them right then, and it doesn't make them right now.
    I have excluded Buddhists, because their 'religion' does not have anything like God. Other religion followers like the sikhs,jains or the zoroastrians etc.are too small in numbers. The total population of earth including the juveniles is about 6.8 billions. I have taken only the adults into the estimate because of simplicity. I am also estimating that the entire adult muslim population is theist, about 80 percent of adult hindus are theists.
  6. Standard memberrvsakhadeo
    rvsakhadeo
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    16 Sep '11 12:13
    Originally posted by googlefudge
    First you can be wrong without being an idiot.
    There are both really smart and really stupid people in both the theist and atheist camps.

    second, I wonder about your numbers, apart from ignoring a whole host of religions...
    do the figures of number of religious people include children?
    Most religions try to inflate their numbers and so almost certa ...[text shortened]... n gets close to 100%.
    This didn't make them right then, and it doesn't make them right now.
    The persistence of 'religious reflex' in humans for thousands of years is now explained by a biologist Jesse Bering as an intrinsic trait carrying powerful evolutionary benefits. To call it as an idiotic blind faith is wrong.
  7. Joined
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    16 Sep '11 12:37
    Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
    I have excluded Buddhists, because their 'religion' does not have anything like God. Other religion followers like the sikhs,jains or the zoroastrians etc.are too small in numbers. The total population of earth including the juveniles is about 6.8 billions. I have taken only the adults into the estimate because of simplicity. I am also estimating that the entire adult muslim population is theist, about 80 percent of adult hindus are theists.
    My point was that the numbers of religious people will include children.
    So you are comparing number of religious people including children, with
    number of people total, without children. you are not comparing like with like.

    That said, i think the numbers are irrelevant to the point in hand.
    I don't care how many people believe in a religion, or any idea, it doesn't on its
    own have any baring on the validity of that idea.
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    16 Sep '11 12:41
    Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
    The persistence of 'religious reflex' in humans for thousands of years is now explained by a biologist Jesse Bering as an intrinsic trait carrying powerful evolutionary benefits. To call it as an idiotic blind faith is wrong.
    I didn't think you believed in evolution? or maybe I am mixing you up with someone else.


    Anyhow, that fact that something has HAD evolutionary benefits, and it is far from a settled
    question as to whether religious belief is a built in evolved concept.
    That doesn't mean that it still does or always will be beneficial.

    Even if it did have benefits in the past, and I am not conceding this point,
    I hold it no-longer has benefits now, and going into the future.

    So I stand by my position that belief in god is stupid.

    [again the belief is stupid, not necessarily the people doing the believing]
  9. Cape Town
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    16 Sep '11 14:11
    Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
    From Wiki, I have estimated that 2.505 billion adult people on this planet are theists. By adult I mean people between 18 and 65 years age. The christians are 1 billion,muslims are 1 billion,hindus are 0.5 billion,jews are 0.5 million. Total adult population of our planet is about 4.5 billions. So is about half of the total population of earth to be considered idiots?
    Since the various religions disagree with each other, there can be absolutely no doubt that the majority of the worlds population is wrong. Whether that is good reason to call them idiots is another matter.
  10. Joined
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    16 Sep '11 14:46
    Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
    From Wiki, I have estimated that 2.505 billion adult people on this planet are theists. By adult I mean people between 18 and 65 years age. The christians are 1 billion,muslims are 1 billion,hindus are 0.5 billion,jews are 0.5 million. Total adult population of our planet is about 4.5 billions. So is about half of the total population of earth to be considered idiots?
    I said 'idiotic blind faith' i called no one an idiot.
  11. Standard memberrvsakhadeo
    rvsakhadeo
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    16 Sep '11 15:11
    Originally posted by googlefudge
    My point was that the numbers of religious people will include children.
    So you are comparing number of religious people including children, with
    number of people total, without children. you are not comparing like with like.

    That said, i think the numbers are irrelevant to the point in hand.
    I don't care how many people believe in a religion, or any idea, it doesn't on its
    own have any baring on the validity of that idea.
    I repeat that from the religious groups I left out the below 18 age people from total population as well as the atheists before estimating the total theist adults from each religion.Total population of earth 6.8 billions.Total adult believers 2.505 billions out of total adult population of 4.5 billions. Buddhists have not been included in 2.505 billions as they are atheists and a no.of small religions are also left out.
    I have compared total theist adults with total adults. the ratio is more than 0.5.
  12. Standard memberrvsakhadeo
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    16 Sep '11 15:21
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Since the various religions disagree with each other, there can be absolutely no doubt that the majority of the worlds population is wrong. Whether that is good reason to call them idiots is another matter.
    On the contrary,there is total agreement among various theistic( non Buddhist) religions about the existence of God.
    The disagreement is about what is the Denotation and Connotation of the term God. The books differ and the ways to realize God differ. But that was not the point of this thread.The essential point is about the belief in God.
    There is no one right description of God nor one right way to realize God. The difficulty arises because God is beyond the capability of human words and mind to be explained as if it is a an emblic nut lying on one palm ( a well used simile in Hindu philosophy). So various religions have various descriptions etc.
  13. Standard memberDasa
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    16 Sep '11 15:321 edit
    Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
    On the contrary,there is total agreement among various theistic( non Buddhist) religions about the existence of God.
    The disagreement is about what is the Denotation and Connotation of the term God. The books differ and the ways to realize God differ. But that was not the point of this thread.The essential point is about the belief in God.
    There is no o ...[text shortened]... m ( a well used simile in Hindu philosophy). So various religions have various descriptions etc.
    There is nowhere that detailed and clear descriptions of the personality of Godhead Sri Krsna can be found other that the Vedanta Sutra.

    Comparing the meat eating religions to Vedanta Sutra cannot be done.

    Vedanta Sutra stands alone.......as the only eternal original true religious system and no other system may be compared or equalled to it............ever.

    Actually while all other systems of religion support animal slaughter they cannot be given the title "religion"................(they are pseudo religions)

    Vedanta Sutra is actually Sanatana Dharma which is above mundane religion.
  14. Cape Town
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    16 Sep '11 16:10
    Originally posted by rvsakhadeo
    On the contrary,there is total agreement among various theistic( non Buddhist) religions about the existence of God.
    The disagreement is about what is the Denotation and Connotation of the term God. The books differ and the ways to realize God differ. But that was not the point of this thread.The essential point is about the belief in God.
    But the fact remains that on many points the majority is necessarily wrong. So any argument that starts with the assumption that the majority are on to something is fundamentally flawed.
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    16 Sep '11 19:50
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    But the fact remains that on many points the majority is necessarily wrong. So any argument that starts with the assumption that the majority are on to something is fundamentally flawed.
    Also polytheism used to massively dominate belief systems.
    monotheism is relatively new, and its monopoly on religious belief very new (in historical terms)

    If the majority used to be polytheist, and are now monotheist, then the majority can evidently be
    wrong.

    Note: actually polytheism with a pantheon of gods actually has fewer logical problems than a single
    omnimax god that is a combination of all of them.
    Having contradictory features spread about through different gods is fine because they can argue
    and fight with each other with no problem.
    Put contradictory features into one being and suddenly it lands up going to war with itself.
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