Two Options

Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
“For God so loved the world, that He gave His [a]only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him." (John 3:16-17) "Footnotes: a.John 3:16 Or unique, only one of His kind." God is rational, reasonable and respects human volition. Choice is yours.

Choice? How so? Answer this: do you think that a person can just choose to believe something that they simply do not believe? If so, why not give an example of you being able to do this in your own life?

Originally posted by divegeester
If somebody doesn't believe in Jesus Christ, or specifically the gospel as laid out in the NT, do you think telling them "the choice is yours" will somehow create in them the ability to choose to believe? Or do you think they will find the comment cold and uncaring?

One might wonder if at least one of them might choose to crack open this book the Christians harp on about to see exactly what it is all about. It's also altogether possible that it might cause one to "change" their mind. Of course, I'm not exactly holding my breath waiting for this to happen, though.

Originally posted by divegeester
If you read the thread without your partisan specs on, I think you will see that GB is the troll in this case. He has started threads with this topic countless times and gets the same responses every time. Look at his reply to twhitehead. GB trolls for attention.

I agree that in a similar situation, I might "give up" and stop talking about it. GB is clearly not me, though.

Jesus is sympathetic to our doubting. And the example of the father who cried out that he was willing to believe and for God to help his unbelief is instructive.

Mark 9:24 -

Jubilee Bible 2000
And straightway the father of the child crying out with tears, said, Lord, I believe; help thou my unbelief.

King James 2000 Bible
And immediately the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help my unbelief.

American King James Version
And straightway the father of the child cried out, and said with tears, Lord, I believe; help you my unbelief.

He is not untouched with the feeling of our weaknesses.

Originally posted by twhitehead
In what way is he acting as if he has a 'horse in this race? In what way is he 'trolling'? Is all debate just trolling? Are you trolling? Certainly you fit the definition better than anyone else here ie you post solely to to try and get a response and not in an attempt to actually communicate anything meaningful.

One might wonder just why does he care? All I've seen is his eagerness to engage GB every single time GB posts, and not only in this forum.

And for your information, I'm not exactly trying to "communicate" anything meaningful (as if FMF is, either). I'm perfectly satisfied that the atheists here are as set in their opinions as I am in mine. One difference here is that you think I'm trying to get a response. I frankly don't care if I get a response, especially since I know that you aren't exactly interested in "communicating" anything meaningful either.

Because "meaningful" is in the ear of the listener. Neither of us considers anything the other may say as "meaningful".

Originally posted by FMF
Choice? How so? Answer this: do you think that a person can just [b]choose to believe something that they simply do not believe? If so, why not give an example of you being able to do this in your own life?[/b]

Exactly how many times do you intend to post this exact same question? Because it really doesn't get any more interesting the more times I hear it.

Originally posted by Suzianne
Exactly how many times do you intend to post this exact same question? Because it really doesn't get any more interesting the more times I hear it.

How many times is Grampy Bobby ~ or anyone else for that matter ~ going to post the exact same assertion that there is somehow a choice for someone to believe something that they simply don't believe? This assertion seems central to his 'ministry' here and his failure/refusal/inability to answer the obvious question is entirely pertinent to the credibility ~ or lack of credibility ~ of what he saying.

Originally posted by Suzianne
And for your information, I'm not exactly trying to "communicate" anything meaningful (as if FMF is, either).

You should try. This is a debate and discussion forum. It would be to the forum's benefit if you did try to communicate something meaningful.

Originally posted by FMF
You should try. This is a debate and discussion forum. It would be to the forum's benefit if you did try to communicate something meaningful.

Like you do? I can't remember the last time I agreed with you. On *anything*.

Originally posted by Suzianne
Like you do? I can't remember the last time I agreed with you. On *anything*.

If I didn't think I was contributing something meaningful, then I wouldn't bother to participate in this community. You have now admitted that you are not trying to communicate anything meaningful here. That is a matter for you. I do not see myself in anything like the way you see yourself ~ although I do think you might be right about yourself.

Originally posted by Suzianne
One might wonder just why does he care?

Yes, one could wonder, or one could speculate or one could try out their mind reading abilities. I find however that the easiest way is to simply ask.

All I've seen is his eagerness to engage GB every single time GB posts, and not only in this forum.
And how does that amount to trolling?

And for your information, I'm not exactly trying to "communicate" anything meaningful
Yes, I can see that. So not trolling, just bitching. Got ya.

I frankly don't care if I get a response, especially since I know that you aren't exactly interested in "communicating" anything meaningful either.
You are wrong about that.

Because "meaningful" is in the ear of the listener.
No. It isn't.

Originally posted by FMF
How many times is Grampy Bobby ~ or anyone else for that matter ~ going to post the exact same assertion that there is somehow a choice for someone to believe something that they simply don't believe? This assertion seems central to his 'ministry' here and his failure/refusal/inability to answer the obvious question is entirely pertinent to the credibility ~ or lack of credibility ~ of what he saying.

We do not know how many times we will refer to a passage like John 3:16.

But if someone reads it 15 times and on the 16th time he realizes something about its truth, it is worth it.

How can you believe something that you don't believe ?
You can't. Now something that you have come to believe - that you can believe. And that is how probably everyone who knows Christ's saving power and presence mysteriously came to enjoy this Person the Lord Jesus.

" the last Adam became a life giving Spirit " (1 Cor. 15:45)

He is in a form in which He is available and experiential.

How can you believe something that you don't believe ?
Continue "hearing" the word of God.
Continue reading it and prayerfully and humbly ask God to help your unbelief.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
[b]How can you believe something that you don't believe ?
Continue "hearing" the word of God.
Continue reading it and prayerfully and humbly ask God to help your unbelief.[/b]

🙄