Originally posted by vistesd
[b] . . .denial or rejection of the laws of logic stultifies human discourse.

I think that, if this implies that all meaningful discourse must obey the laws of logic, then this would unnecessarily narrow the range of what kind of discourse can be considered meaningful. Does lyric poetry, for example, need to be mindful of the law of noncontradiction, ...[text shortened]... will think of what you wrote here.

Thanks for the insightful and thought-provoking response.[/b]

"Some people likely find such a drama to be aesthetically enriching to their lives, and some not so much. I don’t think the Biblical texts need to be taken literally for that, but can be metaphorical, allegorical, symbolic, etc. Others do. "

I remember studying the Aeneid in Latin III*. Virgil wrote it as a way to give divine provenance to the people who identified as Latin, as a "founding myth or national epic." The Bible does that, in a confusing way. Those confusions are still with us, perhaps due to varied authorship.

* In a US public high school.

Originally posted by vistesd

Again, good point—which forced me to think all this through a bit more. I might change my mind next week.
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Knowing Jesus Christ as He is, an available and living Person (albeit an unusual One) provides me with "anchor of the soul, both secure and firm" (Hebrews 6:14) . I knew no lasting or continuing peace of mind before I met Jesus.

I was storm tossed like the sea waves. Not even next week saw a change in mind. Even by the evening my restless mind had to swim around to find a new place of rest. I find today the hymn to be true -

" On Christ the solid rock I stand,
All other ground is sinking sand.
All other ground is sinking sand."

Not knowing God as a living Person yields no rest in the soul.

"There is no peace, says Jehovah, for the wicked" ( Isa. 48:22)

There comes a point when man or woman JUST WANTS PEACE.
A good person, is also tossed restlessly in the mind. For though he compares himself to others and deems himself a good man, he is still a sinner in need of redemption. Because God is not real to him, he has no solid peace.

I know this sounds preachy. But it is very true.

" But the wicked is like the tossed sea, For it cannot be calm, And its waves toss up mire and mud.

There is no peace, says my God, for the wicked." (Isa. 57:20,21)

Peace with God is better than any good philosophy.
Some people posting here are "good people". They at are not belligerent at least. But there are gross sinners. And there are refined and cultured sinners. And there is no peace in the heart and no resting place for the conscience and the searching mind for either.

So how then does one obtain the peace so he can stop shifting from day to day seeking a resting place for the mind ?

Answer: You come to God and agree with Him. "Lord Jesus, I confess I am indeed a sinful person. I just agree with God on this. I no longer argue with God on this." You just drop it all and agree with Him in private that you are that sinner also, that needs divine forgiveness.

In that time you no longer compare yourself to this other worse off fellow over there. You are standing in the light of Jesus Christ. A circle is drawn around you. It is not " I'm not so bad as this man there ". Rather it is that to Jesus Christ the Son of God, you are short of the glory of God, you are not righteous.

You do not think "Tomorrow, I will be better." You do not promise to put forth more effort to self reform. You find peace first by agreeing with God -

" Lord Jesus, I now no longer have a controversy with God about this. I am indeed a sinner. I do indeed need the cleansing of Your precious blood. I do ask for Your redemptive work to reconcile me to God."

The living Person of Christ will give what no philosophy or religion can give - the real lasting inward peace toward God. The peace is finally in knowing the living and available Person of Jesus the Savior. He is unusual and supernatural. But He is AVAILABLE and gives peace deep in the human spirit - Rather He gives Himself as Peace. And here also the restless mind can have peace - can have Peace as a living Person - the triune God.

"And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Comforter, that He may be with you forever, Even the Spirit of reality, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not behold Him or know Him; But you know Him, because He abides with you and shall be in you.

I will not leave you as orphans, I am coming to you." (John 14:16-18)

The coming of this Peace Giver, this Comforter, is the coming of Jesus Christ Himself in another form - "I will not leave you as orphans, I am coming to you."

He is available.

Originally posted by C Hess
If you were once a devout believer, now an atheist, this thread is for you.

I've always been an atheist, so I haven't struggled too much with religious beliefs. I've been curious, looked into it a little, but remain unconvinced. I understand that it couldn't have been just one thing that turned you atheist, but I'm curious if there was one definitive moment when you realised you're no longer a believer.

God did