When will Jesus come back ?

Originally posted by dystoniac
Children killing children like never before, the world events of today are maginified like they never have in human history.

Do you have any reasons for that claim or did you just make it up because you want Jesus to return soon? I always find it interesting how many people badly want the signs to be there.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Do you have any reasons for that claim or did you just make it up I always find it interesting how many people badly want the signs to be there.

The final day can be sooner than we think. It's enough with one guy, who feels that he is sent by his god, to really put his finger on the red button, starting a global nuclear war, helping god a little.

This is not interesting, this is is scary. There are lunatic religious people who more than willingly want to give god a good help to bring the doomsday.

Nuclear weapons should be banned, once and for all. Not by neclear beginers, but also to nations having nukes alreade, like Israel, Russia, India, Pakistan, China - and USA.

Truly interested parties:

One important aspect of the second coming of Christ is likened to the reaping of crops on the earth. Therefore His coming is in reaction to the maturity and ripeness of the crop. Like a farmer, He waits for the harvest in His field. His field is the world. His crop is His saved people.


The growth of the crop means the growth of the indwelling Christ within believers. The ripeness of the crop is the maturity of spiritual growth of Christians to prompt the "sower" and the "farmer" Jesus, to return to reap the mature believers.

A few passages to demonstrate this:

"And I saw, and behold, there was a white cloud, and on the cloud One like the Son of Man sitting, having a golden crown on His head and a sharp sickle in His hand.

And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to Him who sat on the cloud, Send forth You sickle and reap, for the hour to reap has come because the harvest of the earth is ripe.

And He who sat on the cloud thrust His sickle upon the earth, and the earth was reaped." (Rev. 14:14-16)

The symbolism that I emphasize in this post is that of the Son of Man waiting for the "harvest of the earth" to grow to ripeness. He will not reap the crop prematurely. He will wait until maturity is reached. Then the hour comes for Him to gather up the mature crops.

The point here is that the Christians on the earth must mature, grow, develop with the indwelling Christ. This triggers His return and His gathering them up in His second coming.

Your delaying to grow in Christ can postpone His second coming. If you really wanted to do a service for the world you would allow Jesus to grow in you more and more so as to woo Him back to the earth.

We sinners can take part in bring Christ "the desire of the nations" back with global justice and peace and salvation to the environment. How? by doing our little part to recieve Him into us and give Him the ground to grow into all our soul.


I will emphasize this from different angles. Christ living and growing in the Christians as they live Him, live unto Him, and let Him live through them is the catalyst to woo the Son of Man to come back physically to reap "the harvest of the earth".

That is enough for one post.

Originally posted by jaywill
Jesus will come. And as I have said before, when He does most people in the world will think it is too soon rather than too late.

Jesus will come....

how? by what process?

The harvest of the earth must be ripe for the Farmer Jesus to reap His crop. Now of course God has a way to turn up the sunshine so as to "assist" the crop in the ripening process.

Today many Christians simply love the world too much. But God has a way to allow the world to become less and less lovable. The great tribulation is coming. The earth will not be so lovable. And the world will not be such a distraction to Christ's disciples.

The heat and persecutions of the great tribulation will help ripen the harvest of disciples. But we do not have to wait for that. Before the Harvest there are the Firstfruits. Firstfruits are the crop that ripens early. That is a minority. Harvest is the crop that ripens after the Firstfruits ripen.

So there will be firstfruits who will be taken by Christ. Then the great tribulation follows and the majority of the crops are ripened in the heat of that time. Then the harvest of the earth is ripe.

And I would add that the rebellion of sinners will also ripen as the grapes of wrath. God will no longer tolerate these "grapes of wrath". Christ will come not only to positively reap a Harvest of disciples but to deal negatively with the grapes of wrath. This all can be read about in Revelation 14.

My concern is more with the positive side of His return.

Here is where Paul also likens the Christians to growing crops which must mature:

"For we [apostles] are God's fellow workers; you are God's cultivated land [or God's farm], God's building." (1 Cor. 3:9)

The church is God's cultivated land. The apostles are fellow laborers assisting the growth of the crops on God's cultivated land.

Now let's back up and see more of the context of this passage:

"What then is Apollos? And what is Paul? Ministers through whom you believed, even as the Lord gave to each one [of them].

I planted, Apollos watered, But God caused the growth.

So then neither is he who plants anything nor he who waters, but God who causes the growth.

Now he who plants and he who waters are one, but each will receive his own reward according to his own labor.

For we are God's fellow workers; you are God's cultivated land, God's building."


All the minsters are is just planters and waters. God causes the spiritual growth. And the growth is His farming. And the growth is also His building up His living temple - "your are God's cultivated land, God's building."

To grow in Christ is to allow Christ to take you over more and more. And this growth causes oneness. We are built up in oneness more and more because Christ unites the believers to be a corporate dwelling place of God.

Anyway, the growth of Christ is revealed in this passage as well as in Revelation 14. It has much to do with when the Lord Jesus will return. He is like a farmer waiting for the harvest on God's farm.

Originally posted by Andrew Hamilton
[b]Jesus will come....

how? by what process?[/b]

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Jesus will come....

how? by what process?
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Let me preface my remark with this. If you are an unbeliever you have to realize that the secong coming of Christ could come for you at any time.

I mean you have no garuantee that you will see the end of this evening. You could die suddenly in a car accident. Those people in the Twin Towers went to work. Some of them never went home.

You have to realize that if your life (God forbid) were to suddenly end, that is your meeting Christ in His second coming as far as you are concerned.

So if you are an unbeliever, I think, your first priority should be to receive Jesus immediately as your Lord and Savior. What good will it do you to talk about "How will Jesus come?" when you have not yet been saved by the Savior ?

If you were to die suddenly unsaved and in your sins, what good would it do you to know a lot of details about how Jesus will come again? I think you should receive Jesus into your heart now as your Lord and Savior.

Then we can have a context for discussing His second coming.

Originally posted by Andrew Hamilton
[b]Jesus will come....

how? by what process?[/b]

Christ's coming is from two directions.

1.) He comes from some place to the earth. Don't ask me where that place is. I don't know that much. But He must travel from there to here physically.

In this day of advance cosmology and worm holes and all kinds of strange new theories, this should be less of a problem to the modern mind than say 400 years ago. He comes from some dimension somewhere. He comes from Heaven.

2.) A far less appreciated fact is that He comes from within in the way of maturity. His life is in some of the people. He is suppose to grow. He is suppose to take them over and develop in them conforming them more and more to His character.

This is like two ends of a circle meeting. He comes from without and He comes from within.

The without we cannot control. But we can allow Him to come into our hearts and grow more and more. Bit by bit. drop by drop. Here a little, there a little - more and more Jesus is to grow in our personality.

He is coming from above and He is coming from within.

Now how can I prove that He is coming from within as well as also coming from without?

Consider:

1 Thess. 1:10 - "When He [Christ] comes to be glorified in His saints and to be marveled at in all those who have believed ... in that day."


Look. Here is says that in His second coming Christ will be marveled at IN ... IN ... IN all those who have believed.

The worldly people therefore will marvel not only at Christ coming from heaven above. They will marvel at Christ coming out and being manifested IN the Christians. They will marvel at the Christ who suddenly bursts out in expression in all those who have believed.

He was seen in their characters in one way. It was a moral expression. But in His second coming the moral expression becomes the splendid glorified expression.

The world will marvel at the Christ manifested IN the beleivers. So He comes from above and He comes from within.

This is a general discription. It does not deal with all aspects and problems of the matter. This is general. I so much want Christ to be marveled at IN me when He comes. So this being an incentive, I seek to allow Christ to grow in me more and more.

This is not only an enjoyment but also a great service to mankind. I am participating in the bringing of Jesus Christ back to the earth.

If there is a higher calling for a human being, I do not know what it could be.

Now the physical aspect. Not everyone all over the globe will witness Christ descending. This is impossible. For He must come and locate Himself somewhere on the planet.

The people who will see Him descend will be mainly the people in the Middle East. In Israel and in that area, they will SEE Him come down.

"Behold, He comes with the clouds, and every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him; and all the tribes of the land will mourn over Him. Yes, amen." (Rev. 1:7)

This refers to the seeing of the 12 tribes of the land of Israel. In the land of Israel particularly, they will see Christ coming on the clouds of heaven.

The effects on nature however, will probably be seen all over the globe. They will know something is happening. But He touches down in Israel.

This is concerning His physical descent to the earth. He has to come to a location. And in that location they will see Him descend.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
How would we recognize a new Jesus? He maybe be here already? Perhaps even I am the new Jesus, not yet recognized?

Hitler could very well be saying that he was the new Jesus, and people would believe him, locally anyway.

So how do we know, how would we recognize a new Jesus? Because he says so?

So how do we know, how would we recognize a new Jesus? Because he says so?

We should let Jesus Himself answer that question:

As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. "Tell us," they said, "when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" Jesus answered: "Watch out that no one deceives you. For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many."

"At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or, 'There he is!' do not believe it. For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect—if that were possible. See, I have told you ahead of time. So if anyone tells you, 'There he is, out in the desert,' do not go out; or, 'Here he is, in the inner rooms,' do not believe it. For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man.

"At that time the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and all the nations of the earth will mourn. They will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of the sky, with power and great glory."

~ Matthew 24:3-5, 23-27, 30
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I don't think anyone is going to have trouble recognizing the genuine article.

Originally posted by dystoniac
Jesus stated that He would return soon. In Biblical terms, 'soon' can mean tomorrow or another thosand years, but Jesus gave hints about the last days, and we are experiencing many of those prophesies even today. The Jews being given a homeland was prophosied and has come true. Children killing children like never before, the world events of today are m ...[text shortened]... normal and God's laws are looked at abnormal, then the day is quite near for Jesus' return.

Obama becoming President should be a sign.

Originally posted by epiphinehas
[b]So how do we know, how would we recognize a new Jesus? Because he says so?

We should let Jesus Himself answer that question:

[i]As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. "Tell us," they said, "when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" Jesus answered: " don't think anyone is going to have trouble recognizing the genuine article.[/b]

This is very good.

In the RcV [Recovery Version] the KJV "nations of the earth" there in 24:30 translates to "tribes of the land."

Its worth me looking into that.

Originally posted by epiphinehas
So how do we know, how would we recognize a new Jesus? Because he says so?

We should let Jesus Himself answer that question:

As Jesus was sitting on the Mount of Olives, the disciples came to him privately. "Tell us," they said, "when will this happen, and what will be the sign of your coming and of the end of the age?" Jesus answered: " don't think anyone is going to have trouble recognizing the genuine article.[/b]

Firstly, this is not words from the mouth of Jesus, it's hearsay, nothing more. The book of Matthew was ritten around 80 AD, noone knows by whom.

Secondly, Muhammed was presented this way. According th the quote, Mohammed was the new Jesus, Jesus desribed this very well.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Firstly, this is not words from the mouth of Jesus, it's hearsay, nothing more. The book of Matthew was ritten around 80 AD, noone knows by whom.

Secondly, Muhammed was presented this way. According th the quote, Mohammed was the new Jesus, Jesus desribed this very well.

Wrong. The book was credited to Matthew by the early church fathers, and was written shortly before the destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70 - within a generation of those who witnessed the ministry of Christ firsthand. There is no record of any disciple or follower of Jesus contesting the accuracy of Matthew (or Luke, or Mark, for that matter), and biblical scholarship and archeological findings have only served to demonstrate the accuracy of the apostles' testimonies as historical records. The reliability of the Synoptic documents are unsurpassed by all standards compared to all other ancient writings and cannot be disparaged as easily as you would like without betraying a personal bias or a lack of scholarship, or both.

Muhammad did not fulfill all prophecies concerning the return of Christ, so I doubt your claim that he was the "new Jesus."

Originally posted by jaywill
This is very good.

In the RcV [Recovery Version] the KJV [b]"nations of the earth" there in 24:30 translates to "tribes of the land."

Its worth me looking into that.[/b]

It makes sense that the nations would "mourn" at the sign of Christ's return. Game over, right? Even I would probably mourn, too. Part of me wants to have enough time to raise my daughter and see her life unfold, and I'd like to grow old with my wife in a comfy country home on the open prairie, looking at the sky with my reflector telescope, etc. Yeah, I want to be with Jesus and witness the wonders of God's glory in my glorified body, but I'd also like to spend the next fifty years cuddling with The Wife night after night, listening to thunderstorms roll through in the early morning, etc. I can see how there would be plenty to mourn for.