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Rajk999 continues:
It is also a good demonstration of the extent of the brainwashing i the church to the point where followers cannot read and understand even when the bible says the opposite of what the church preaches.
On his usual soapbox about how he's the only one left who is clear about the truth and everyone else is brainwashed.
Husbands are directed to love their wives AS CHRIST ALSO LOVED THE CHURCH. Which is more real - Human marriage of Divine Marriage? Which is the type and which is the more solid reality to which the type points?
Human marriages will end. But Christ's marriage to His wife will be FOREVER - unto eternity. Human marriage therefore, though real, is only a shadow of the true marriage of Christ and the church.
There is no clear statement that the Christian church is the bride of Christ but there is a crystal clear statement that it is not.
There is no clear realization in Rajk999's religiosity.
The Bride makes herself ready for the marriage by the righteous deeds or righteousnesses [sic] which qualify her for the wedding. This we see in Revelation 19.
Let us rejoice and exult, and let us give the glory to Him, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His wife has made herself ready.
And it was given to her that she should be clothed in fine linen, bright and clean; for the fine linen is the righteousnesses [sic] of the saints. (Rev. 19:7,8)
So the Bible says the marriage of the Lamb, the God-man Redeemer has come. And Rajk999 in his pretensions of phony expertise says there is no marriage of Christ and the church. He says there's no clear word on this. But there must be a thick black veil over his eyes when he comes to Revelation 19:7,8.
Verse 19 -
And he said to me, Write, Blessed are they who are called to the marriage dinner of the Lamb. And he said to me, These are the true words of God. (v.19)
These ARE the true words of God concerning the MARRIAGE DINNER of Christ the Lamb of God.
And Rajk999 has the audacity to speak about anybody being brainwashed. He is so brainwashed that he cannot see the plain truth before his eyes. There is to be a MARRIAGE DINNER of the Lamb. How can there be a marriage dinner if there is to be no marriage?
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Rajk999 waves his hands about another aspect of the relationship of the saved to Christ. He cannot have enough room in his puny head for BOTH truths. He has to pretentiously argue that because one is written then the other is not true.
Yet Christians routinely refer to their church as the bride of Christ. Here are two statements from Paul referring to the church / members as the BODY of Christ
The New Testament said that Christ died for the church To present Himself with this romantic corporate other. This groups happens ALSO to have a relationship as members of His body. The New Testament is rich and shows the relationship from more than one angle.
New Jerusalem is the church enlarged to include all of the saints of the old covenant and of the new covenant. And New Jerusalem is the Wife of the Lamb.
The old covenant saints are represented by the names of the twelve tribes of Israel on her symbolic gates (Rev. 21:12).
The new covenant saints are represented by the names of the twelve apostles of the Lamb on her symbolic foundations (Rev. 21:14)
As a climax of all of God's redeeming work, sanctifying work, transforming work, glorifying work, the New Jerusalem is the WIFE of the Redeemer God-man Jesus Christ.
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And I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and the sea is no more.
And I saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. (Rev. 21:1,2)
This is the enlarged and expanded church including old covenant saints and new covenant saints from all the ages and everyone regenerated by Christ to receive Him as life. She is a city / bride.
This is the final scene of the whole Bible, involving the WIFE of Christ brought to Him for a romantic eternal future and a dwelling place of God within humanity -
And one of the seven angels who had the seven bowls full of the seven last plagues came and spoke with me, saying, Come here; I will show you the bride, the wife of the Lamb." (Rev. 21:9)
Rajk999 would like us all to shut our eyes to be as blind as himself to NOT see the bride the wife of the Lamb.
He waves his hands to point us to:
1Co_12:27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
Eph_4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
In his blindness he figures that because these verses are true, somehow, therefore, verses about Christ presenting the church to Himself as a cleansed wife cannot be true.
He imagines that he has the real inside story. But he has nothing but blindness and accusation that everyone else is brainwashed.
@thinkofone saidA most appropriate passage
The answer to this thread's title can be gleaned from the following:
John 8
34Jesus answered them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, everyone who commits sin is the slave of sin.
31...“If you abide in My word, then you are truly disciples of Mine; 32and you will know the truth, and the truth will make you free.”
41“You are doing the deeds of your father.” 42Jesus said t ...[text shortened]... u are not of God.”
51“Truly, truly, I say to you, if anyone keeps My word he will never see death.”
@sonship saidNothing there says the church is the bride of Christ.
@Rajk999The doctrine that the church is the bride of Christ, is prevalent throughout Christianity. It is not a critical doctrine to believe either way and in my opinion neither will it impact on ones eternal life, but Jesus Christ will have a good laugh are the stupidity of some people.
This is Rajk999's phony sounding expertise. The New Testament teac ...[text shortened]...
The phony expertise of Rajk999 figures surely he must use one aspect to fight against the other.
Paul says the church is the body of Christ
Your arguing is pointless.
@sonship saidThe righteous church members are called to the marriage supper of the Lamb. What culture do you live in, where those called / invited to a wedding are the ones getting married? The church is called to feast at the marriage. The marriage is between Christ and the New Jerusalem. The bride and groom need no invigtation. They are hosting the feast. The invitees are to witness the celebrations and to dine and feast. Invitees do not get married.
Rajk999 continues:It is also a good demonstration of the extent of the brainwashing i the church to the point where followers cannot read and understand even when the bible says the opposite of what the church preaches.
On his usual soapbox about how he's the only one left who is clear about the truth and everyone else is brainwashed.
Husbands are ...[text shortened]... be a MARRIAGE DINNER of the Lamb. How can there be a marriage dinner if there is to be no marriage?
@sonship saidNonsense. Not worthy of a reply.
Rajk999 waves his hands about another aspect of the relationship of the saved to Christ. He cannot have enough room in his puny head for BOTH truths. He has to pretentiously argue that because one is written then the other is not true.
[quote]
Yet Christians routinely refer to their church as the bride of Christ. Here are two statements from Paul referring to the ch ...[text shortened]... nsforming work, glorifying work, the New Jerusalem is the WIFE of the Redeemer God-man Jesus Christ.
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@sonship saidAnd there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife. And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, (Revelation 21:9-10 KJV)And I saw a new heaven and a new earth; for the first heaven and the first earth passed away, and the sea is no more.
And I saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. (Rev. 21:1,2)
This is the enlarged and expanded church including old covenant saints and new covenant sa ...[text shortened]... eal inside story. But he has nothing but blindness and accusation that everyone else is brainwashed.
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Nothing there says the church is the bride of Christ.
Paul says the church is the body of Christ
Your arguing is pointless.
1.) Most Bible readers know that "the Lamb" stands for the Redeemer Jesus Who died on the cross as "the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world."
When Revelation 19:7 says -
Let us rejoice ... for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and His bride has made herself ready ..."
What OTHER entity could the Bible be taking about BESIDES the body of saved people for whom Christ died ?
Will Rajk999 identify some OTHER group of "Lamb" redeemed people who would constitute Christ's Wife and Bride.
2.) When John sees a city coming out of God in heaven he calls "prepared as a bride adorned for her husband" (Rev. 21:2), what OTHER entity could the Bible be referring to besides the church universal ?
3.) When Revelation 22:17 says -
And the Spirit and the bride say, Come!
What OTHER entity could this "bride" be besides the church universal ?
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And there came unto me one of the seven angels which had the seven vials full of the seven last plagues, and talked with me, saying, Come hither, I will shew thee the bride, the Lamb's wife. And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God, (Revelation 21:9-10 KJV)
The translation is not good in that it should read "the HOLY city" not "great city".
And he carried me away in spirit onto a great and high mountain and showed me the HOLY city, Jerusalem, coming doesn't out of heaven from God. Recovery Version NT
Revelation is a book of signs (Rev. 1:1).
The revelation of Jesus Christ which God gave to Him to show to His slaves what must swiftly take place; and He made it known by SIGNS, sending it to His slave, John. (Rev. 1:1)
God made know the final climax of world history and culmination of His salvation over all His redeemed people at the end with the SIGN of a city. On one hand this city is the tabernacle and temple of the living God. But another aspect to her is that she is the Bride the Wife of the Lamb.
She has been made thoroughly holy as God has dispensed His holy nature into her. The entire corporate "city" as an aggregate of all of God's saved people have become a corporate body to match Christ and manifest God dwelling in man.
It is artificial and erroneous for Rajk999 to invent a difference that the tabernacle of God there is not also the Wife as the church universal. For it is for the church that God in Christ gave up His life and purchased with His own blood.
"Take heed to yourselves and to all the flock, among whom the Holy Spirit has placed you as overseers to shepherd the church of God, which He obtained through His own blood." (Acts 20:28)
What did the redeeming God obtained with His own blood? - "the church of God".
For whom did the Lamb of God die accomplishing eternal redemption? - "the church of God".
Does the church having the aspect of being the body of Christ cause it to then NOT be the bride and wife of Christ?
Only in Rajk999's twisted, heretical darkness. She is both His body and His wife.
Just as Eve came out of Adam's body so the universal church comes out of the incarnate God.
"Because we are members of His Body. For this cause a man shall leave his father and mother and shall be joined to his wife, and the two shall be one flesh.
This mystery is great, but I speak with regard to Christ and the church." (Eph. 5:30-32) [/b]
Because the church is Christ's body is no cause argue the church is not to be the Wife of Christ.
" ... I speak of Christ and the church"
Meaning Paul speaks of the Body of Christ and Christ is to speak of "Christ and the church" .
And for Paul to speak of the husband and the wife is to speak of "Christ and the church".
The illogic of Rajk999's argument is the same as arguing that because Eve came out of Adam and was brought back to be one flesh with Adam, therefore she was not his wife. This would be ludicrous to argue.
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@suzianne saidWhy do you and others keep pretending that you don't understand that the issue is that most Christians here don't believe that they must "abide in [His] word", "keep [His] word", be righteous, etc. as a requirement to live in the kingdom / receive eternal life?
Now you (or ToO) show us the passage that says most here don't do this.
@sonship saidWhy do you need some OTHER entity when the bible states clearly that the bride is the New Jesusalem. Is that not good enough for you?Nothing there says the church is the bride of Christ.
Paul says the church is the body of Christ
Your arguing is pointless.
1.) Most Bible readers know that "the Lamb" stands for the Redeemer Jesus Who died on the cross as "the Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world."
When Revelation 19:7 says -
[quote ...[text shortened]... e say, Come! [/quote]
What OTHER entity could this "bride" be besides the church universal ?
The bride - New Jerusalem or the Kingdom of God
The wedding guests - the Church or the body of Christ.
End of story
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Paul points to the formation of Eve the WIFE of Adam in his explanation about Christ and the church.
And Jehovah God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; and He took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh in its place.
And Jehovah BUILT the rib, which He had taken from the man, into a woman and brought her to the man. (Genesis 2:21,23)
The WIFE of Adam came OUT of Adam's body. The life of Adam in his body was transferred over to the WOMAN that God built from Adam's rib into his counterpart. No animal, no other creature, was suitable to match Adam. Only that which came OUT of Adam's body carrying with it the life that Adam had.
And the man said. This time this is bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh;
This one shall be called Woman because out of Man this one was taken." (Genesis 2:23)
Rajk999 is making an equivalent argument that because Eve was of Adam's body THEREFORE somehow she could not be Adam's wife. This is NONSENSE. That point of the story is exactly that what was his body God built into his wife.
Rajk999 points to the church as the body of Christ and says that because of this the church is not the wife of Christ.
So Rajk99 is taking the Bible to make it say the OPPOSITE of what it says. This is the twisted devilment coming out of his ignorance.
The EXACT POINT of Paul is that the story of Eve coming out of Adam to marry Adam is the great mystery of Christ and His wife - the universal church.
" ... For this cause a man ... shall be joined to his wife, and the two shall be one flesh. This mystery is great, but I speak with regard to Christ and the church" (Eph. 5: 31b-32)