Why the catholic church is losing people

Originally posted by ivanhoe
Luke
Chapter 18


18
An official asked him this question, "Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?"
19
Jesus answered him, "Why do you call me good? No one is good but God alone.
20
You know the commandments, 'You shall not commit adultery; you shall not kill; you shall not steal; you shall not bear false witness; honor your fathe **********************

What was Jesus' objective on earth in your view ?

Well, Generalissimo ? What was Jesus' objective on earth in your view ?

Originally posted by generalissimo
After years thinking about the teachings of the church about morality, I realised that these are responsible for the decreasing number of catholics in Latin America and elsewhere.

Having lived in some Latin American countries myself, I got the impression that the church's view on contraception, abortion, and other social issues is only damaging the ...[text shortened]... esus' objective on earht really was, instead of worrying about going to hell for masturbating.

Why do you think denominations which do have married priests, or whatever you want to call them, and which do allow unnatural contraception are also losing members in the Western and westernised countries ?

Originally posted by ivanhoe
Well, Generalissimo ? What was Jesus' objective on earth in your view ?

Save humanity?

Show that love is important (because he died for all of us).

Not to condenm people, but to save them.

Originally posted by whodey
Top reasons for the demise of Catholic church

1. No one can understand a darn latin word they are saying, problaby because it is a dead language. Not a smart move.
2. Pope John Paul recently died. Everyone thoght that was it.
3. They don't just let members of NAMBLA confess, they seem to want to ordain them as well
4. Effect of RHP spirituality forum

1. No one can understand a darn latin word they are saying, problaby because it is a dead language. Not a smart move.

Since the second vatican council, they have mass in the native language of the country.

3. They don't just let members of NAMBLA confess, they seem to want to ordain them as well

This is false.

4. Effect of RHP spirituality forum

No way.

Originally posted by Conrau K
[b]How would priests know about sex, and issues related to it if they don't have sexual lives themselves?

Hopefully most priests will not know about the ins and outs of sex. But they do not need that knowledge in order to make a moral judgement about contraception or abortion. Sex does not exactly give anyone a unique qualification in ethics.[/b]

Do you think God would send people to hell when they died, because during their life-time they were raped and decided to abort the foetus (the result of such unholy sexual act)?

Originally posted by generalissimo
[b]1. No one can understand a darn latin word they are saying, problaby because it is a dead language. Not a smart move.

Since the second vatican council, they have mass in the native language of the country.

3. They don't just let members of NAMBLA confess, they seem to want to ordain them as well

This is false.

4. Effect of RHP spirituality forum

No way.[/b]

😛

Originally posted by generalissimo
Do you think God would send people to hell when they died, because during their life-time they were raped and decided to abort the foetus (the result of such unholy sexual act)?

I do not think so. I think a woman who was raped would be so emotionally traumatised that she could not be reasonably held responsible for her actions. But that does not make abortion right. A life is still being killed. I think that whole situation tragic.

Originally posted by Conrau K
I do not think so. I think a woman who was raped would be so emotionally traumatised that she could not be reasonably held responsible for her actions. But that does not make abortion right. A life is still being killed. I think that whole situation tragic.

at last we agree on something!

Originally posted by Conrau K
The Church has not forbidden marriage. A priest may leave orders and get married. The choice is always there. It is just generally a condition that a priest not be married. At no time has the Catholic Church made sex or marriage a contraband.

Whereas the issues of contraception and abortion are authoritative and
infallible teachings, the issue of priestly celibacy is not. The Pope could
rescind the celibacy requirements with a wave of his crozier for all future
ordinations.

Nemesio

Originally posted by Nemesio
Whereas the issues of contraception and abortion are authoritative and
infallible teachings, the issue of priestly celibacy is not. The Pope could
rescind the celibacy requirements with a wave of his crozier for all future
ordinations.

Nemesio

Not all celibacy requirements. A member of a religious order for example must take a solemn vow of chastity according to a celibate life. I do not think the Pope does have the power to rescind the celibacy requirements because these are definitively part of the charism of the order.

Originally posted by Conrau K
Not all celibacy requirements. A member of a religious order for example must take a solemn vow of chastity according to a celibate life. I do not think the Pope does have the power to rescind the celibacy requirements because these are definitively part of the charism of the order.

I was thinking about Diocesan priests when I wrote my post. But the Pope
does indeed have the right to rescind the requirement for the Sacrament of
Ordination, which would be for all ordinations.

However, as you say, if the charism of the order requires the solemn vow of
chastity, then an individual would simply be unable to petition to join that
particular order. The Pope doesn't have 'jurisdiction' to tell a particular order
whether they must rescind chastity (or poverty, e.g.), but he can say that
they need not require it.

The issue of celibacy is a discipline, not a matter of doctrine. If the Pope
were to rescind it, it would not stop some priests from living a single and
thus celibate lifestyle, just as some observant Roman Catholics who are
not ordained are called to the vocation of single life.

Nemesio

Originally posted by ivanhoe
The Church looks upon the practise of abortion and unnatural ways of contraception as damaging to people. You cannot expect the Church to change these views just to increase the numbers of Roman-Catholics. ... the Church is not a political party, which aim is to please a certain segment of voters in their short sighted, self-serving needs.

You have never said truer words, Ivanhoe.

However, one of the disingenuous aspects of the Church is its tacit acceptance
of contraception, especially in the wealthy American churches. That is, we know
for a certainty that some 95% of active Roman Catholics are utilizing (artificial)
contraception. And despite the fact that the Church considers this to be a
sin against nature, there are very few sermons regarding the issue, and
Roman Catholics are not discouraged from participating Sacramentally even
while knowingly and willingly sinning against the God (according to the Church).

That is: the Church teaches that participating in Communion while not in a
state of grace is bad for one's soul. And yet the Church is nearly silent to
its (wealthy) American parishioners who are damaging their soul not only
by using contraception, but by coming to the Table of the Lord after having
done so.

Other than greed, how do you explain this?

Nemesio

Originally posted by Nemesio
I was thinking about Diocesan priests when I wrote my post. But the Pope
does indeed have the right to rescind the requirement for the Sacrament of
Ordination, which would be for all ordinations.

However, as you say, if the charism of the order requires the solemn vow of
chastity, then an individual would simply be unable to petition to join that
par ...[text shortened]... t Roman Catholics who are
not ordained are called to the vocation of single life.

Nemesio

I have no problem with that. The Pope is perfectly within his right to alter the requirements for the priesthood.

Originally posted by Nemesio
Other than greed, how do you explain this?

The Sunday Mass sermon is probably an inappropriate medium for priests to discuss the evils of contraception. And most priests, I suspect, do not believe that contraception is evil anyway.

Originally posted by Conrau K
The Pope is perfectly within his right to alter the requirements for the priesthood.

This is not true. Since the Church has asserted authoritatively (i.e., infallibly)
that only men are eligible for the priesthood, the Pope could not alter that
requirement.

Nemesio