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  1. 05 Jul '10 13:11
    Throughout the tournament Del Bosque has been saying that Torres has been doing a very good job. However his playing on the pitch hasn't been great, and he has no goals. Could he still be doing a good job anyway?

    The way that they're set up, Torres out in front, is very interesting from a tactical perspective. Torres isn't on form, but he does pose a credible threat that needs to be marked. He definitely has the ability to turn a long pass into a goal, thus preventing opponents from pushing too far up. And those that do, like Paraguay who press brilliantly for the whole match, end up exhausted at having to run back and forth. But he's not scoring, mostly just threatening, so he acts like a thorn in the boot of the other team.

    Would you say that Spain are underachieving as usual, or is this a very clever tactic to ensure a win? Exhaust your opponents and stretch out the field with an out of form, unfit, potentially dangerous striker, while the rest of the team gradually move forward and shots on goal come from them.

    "99% of the time our style of play means victory." - Villa.

    There is a chance that Torres may not start against Germany and I'm not surprised as I don't see this tactic working against them.

    So are Spain playing well and grinding out results according to plan, or are they underachieving and playing lacklustre football?
  2. Standard member Grampy Bobby
    Boston Lad
    05 Jul '10 13:19
    Originally posted by hopscotch
    Throughout the tournament Del Bosque has been saying that Torres has been doing a very good job. However his playing on the pitch hasn't been great, and he has no goals. Could he still be doing a good job anyway?

    The way that they're set up, Torres out in front, is very interesting from a tactical perspective. Torres isn't on form, but he does pose a cr ...[text shortened]... t results according to plan, or are they underachieving and playing lacklustre football?
    Soccer Tournament's finally getting exciting for the first time in years for me

    (thanks to this sports forum). I'm guessing Germany, if they stay healthy.
  3. 05 Jul '10 13:26
    Originally posted by hopscotch
    Throughout the tournament Del Bosque has been saying that Torres has been doing a very good job. However his playing on the pitch hasn't been great, and he has no goals. Could he still be doing a good job anyway?

    The way that they're set up, Torres out in front, is very interesting from a tactical perspective. Torres isn't on form, but he does pose a cr ...[text shortened]... t results according to plan, or are they underachieving and playing lacklustre football?
    Excellent obesrvations! Torres is not playing well, but poses huge threat. I agree del Bosque's tactics would not be practical against a fast, young, physical team like Germany. Del Bosque is adaptable and is a master tactitcian. Should be a great game and I see it as a toss up. This will be by far the strongest, most tactically sound defense Germany will have faced and also the strongest midfield. I see a slight edge for Spain, but Germany can grind out a gritty win a la Spain any day!
  4. 05 Jul '10 13:28
    Originally posted by scacchipazzo
    Excellent obesrvations! Torres is not playing well, but poses huge threat. I agree del Bosque's tactics would not be practical against a fast, young, physical team like Germany. Del Bosque is adaptable and is a master tactitcian. Should be a great game and I see it as a toss up. This will be by far the strongest, most tactically sound defense Germany wi ...[text shortened]... ield. I see a slight edge for Spain, but Germany can grind out a gritty win a la Spain any day!
    my dear friends, 'tactics dont win games, players do', Brian Clough
  5. 05 Jul '10 14:00
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    my dear friends, 'tactics dont win games, players do', Brian Clough
    'Soccer is a game for 22 people that run around, play the ball, and one referee who makes a slew of mistakes, and in the end Germany always wins.' -Gary Lineker
  6. Standard member Grampy Bobby
    Boston Lad
    05 Jul '10 14:45
    Originally posted by Svin1
    'Soccer is a game for 22 people that run around, play the ball, and one referee who makes a slew of mistakes, and in the end Germany always wins.' -Gary Lineker
    Postscript: As with lively honest conversation, rough and tumble chess full of surprises as well

    as any point in time engagements in war... bottom line is usually who is on their game today.




    ........................................................
  7. Standard member orion25
    Art is hard
    05 Jul '10 14:53
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    my dear friends, 'tactics dont win games, players do', Brian Clough
    So who has the better players in technical terms? Germany or Argentina?

    Germany won the game due to superior tactics and better coaching.
  8. 05 Jul '10 14:59
    Originally posted by orion25
    So who has the better players in technical terms? Germany or Argentina?

    Germany won the game due to superior tactics and better coaching.
    Indeed. Gameplanning for Germany must be a real nightmare. They look like a pick your poison kind of a team, but will be weaker without Muller, unfairly excluded because of the silly, phantom yellow. Spain is more disciplined than Argentina, has better ball control and a stouter D than Argentina. They also win balls back up front. Should be an excellent game. ON flip side, Spain has not faced a center back like Friedrich or a right back like Lahm. Although I don;t see Germany's D as stout as Paraguay's they are fast. Spain will have faced tourney's three best D's and that experience might help against Germany. Who knows.
  9. 05 Jul '10 16:47
    Originally posted by scacchipazzo
    Excellent obesrvations! Torres is not playing well, but poses huge threat. I agree del Bosque's tactics would not be practical against a fast, young, physical team like Germany. Del Bosque is adaptable and is a master tactitcian. Should be a great game and I see it as a toss up. This will be by far the strongest, most tactically sound defense Germany wi ...[text shortened]... ield. I see a slight edge for Spain, but Germany can grind out a gritty win a la Spain any day!
    This is the match I really wanted to see. Only one team impressed me in this WC and it's Germany. The machine is too weak a comparison for them. (The Serbia game doesn't count - they were playing with 10 men).

    Spain were disappointing vs Paraguay, and not too impressive in general. Paraguay showed that they are vulnerable to pressing, but I don't believe Germany will resort to it. But, Spain is still technically the best team in the world, and have a rare ability to play as a single organism.

    As I read in one article, two years ago in Euro 2008 it was Spain playing and Germany laboring their wins until they met in the finals, and now it's the opposite. So, based on its current form Germany is stronger, but Spain has potential.

    Tomorrow's game could become a classic. I boldly predict 3-2 for Spain.
  10. 05 Jul '10 17:50
    Originally posted by infomast
    This is the match I really wanted to see. Only one team impressed me in this WC and it's Germany. The machine is too weak a comparison for them. (The Serbia game doesn't count - they were playing with 10 men).

    Spain were disappointing vs Paraguay, and not too impressive in general. Paraguay showed that they are vulnerable to pressing, but I don't believe ...[text shortened]... has potential.

    Tomorrow's game could become a classic. I boldly predict 3-2 for Spain.
    It is indeed a toss up. What is scary is that Spain has not yet reached its full form. Paraguay game not necessarily a good barometer since matchups issues misleadingly give us impression of a team not as good as it is. Del Bosque is finally sitting Torres so he's seen the light. Probably will insert Fabregas instead. Where Germany may hit a wall is that an open game favors Spain. Germany is not used to a defensive gameplan since they are always out for a win the old fashioned way, that is, pressing forward with might. And mighty they are! It should be a great game indeed. Better than the other semi! Like you said, Spain has the rare ability of playing as one organism.
  11. 05 Jul '10 18:07
    Originally posted by infomast
    This is the match I really wanted to see. Only one team impressed me in this WC and it's Germany. The machine is too weak a comparison for them. (The Serbia game doesn't count - they were playing with 10 men).

    Spain were disappointing vs Paraguay, and not too impressive in general. Paraguay showed that they are vulnerable to pressing, but I don't believe ...[text shortened]... has potential.

    Tomorrow's game could become a classic. I boldly predict 3-2 for Spain.
    van persie aside you can't help but be impressed with what holland have done as well, sure they haven't been playing petty football or faced anyone of great quality other than brazil who mentally lost it against them but still, they've done what they set out to do and with uruguay missing suarez look set to make the final having not lost or even drawn a match (assuming they beat uruguay in 90 mins).

    germany has been a different class though, even in the serbia match with 10 men they looked the much better side and probably still should've won.

    the muller lose might be key but i still fancy germany, mostly because i want to see a holland/germany final. they HATE each other.
  12. Standard member orion25
    Art is hard
    05 Jul '10 18:13
    Originally posted by trev33
    van persie aside you can't help but be impressed with what holland have done as well, sure they haven't been playing petty football or faced anyone of great quality other than brazil who mentally lost it against them but still, they've done what they set out to do and with uruguay missing suarez look set to make the final having not lost or even drawn a match ...[text shortened]... l fancy germany, mostly because i want to see a holland/germany final. they HATE each other.
    Agreed. Even I admit Germany has been the best team in the tournament, surpassing even Holland. I want them to reach the final, so we can finally take back what is rightfully ours. Don't see us wining the final, right now, though.
  13. Subscriber karoly aczel
    Happy Chappy
    05 Jul '10 18:34 / 1 edit
    Go Spain!
    Start Torres.
    He is due.
    Germany has the hinderance of being German. A bit of creativity, an early goal and that young German side will crumble.
    Not to mention Villa.
    Spain are peaking at the right time and with Brazil out of the way...the door is open. Get your wallets out. Spain 3-1
  14. 05 Jul '10 18:42 / 4 edits
    Originally posted by orion25
    So who has the better players in technical terms? Germany or Argentina?

    Germany won the game due to superior tactics and better coaching.
    massive fail of a post,

    firstly Argentina are not a 'technical', team but have exceptionally good naturally gifted players, which suits their style and temperament,

    many of their players play in Europe and have some of the best coaching staff, anywhere in the world,

    it was nothing to do with tactics, coaching, technicalities or anything else? it was because of Schweinsteiger, Klose, Ozil, Podolski and Muller that Germany won that game. i therefore repeat the assertion, tactics dont win matches, players do.
  15. 05 Jul '10 19:01
    Originally posted by robbie carrobie
    i therefore repeat the assertion, tactics dont win matches, players do.
    players who follow and execute good tactics win matches.